crimthinc...

[Harrison Bergeron]

Haha. Books. Read 'em when yer bored. Burn 'em when yer cold. Isn't that what they say?

 

[wartomods]

wartomods, you're weird.

how so ??

 

[veggieguy12]

You're often making simple three-word comments, and I have to seek out the meaning or relevant connection to whatever the discussion is. Your remarks are so brief and simple I wonder why you bother to post them.
I dunno, maybe it's just a non-English language issue.
Don't want to get the thread off-topic...

 

[wartomods]

You're often making simple three-word comments, and I have to seek out the meaning or relevant connection to whatever the discussion is. Your remarks are so brief and simple I wonder why you bother to post them.
I dunno, maybe it's just a non-English language issue.
Don't want to get the thread off-topic...

Well you are right, but rare are the times that one of my post as brief as they can be do not carry some substancial meaning.

 

[RebeccaSoup]

I'm a crimethinc kid. most of the important people in my life have been deeply involved with crimethinc at some point. I've read and heard and felt all the arguments till I was blue in the face it doesn't change the fact and idea that action is just that. If there were a functional funded and productive collective to be a part of that didn't use romantic propaganda in a recruitist type fashion, maybe i would be a part of that. but there's not. a decentralized, productive faction of anarchists (lifestylists or not, I'm an anti-civ girl, myself) is better than nothing. I'm an activist. I define that as I please. And I live without regret. The only people Ive met to accept that are crimethincers.

That said, I thought evasion sucked.:die:

The end.

 

[hassysmacker]

I'm a crimethinc kid. most of the important people in my life have been deeply involved with crimethinc at some point. I've read and heard and felt all the arguments till I was blue in the face it doesn't change the fact and idea that action is just that. If there were a functional funded and productive collective to be a part of that didn't use romantic propaganda in a recruitist type fashion, maybe i would be a part of that. but there's not. a decentralized, productive faction of anarchists (lifestylists or not, I'm an anti-civ girl, myself) is better than nothing. I'm an activist. I define that as I please. And I live without regret. The only people Ive met to accept that are crimethincers.

That said, I thought evasion sucked.:die:

The end.

I agree with all of that and feel the same way. ANd I'm anti-civ! And Evasion DID suck! Fuck that shit.

Are you aware of Deep Green Resistance in june in MA with d. jensen and buddies?

 

[L.C.]

i think this arguement is petty. anything for the cause no matter how small is a help. if they aren't for you they are probably against you. i don't think it matters what your 'ism' is as long as its headed the same way. after the beast is slayed, then we can nit-pick, and go our own ways.

 

[seke]

What is this consent crap that people keep talking about? I never heard about it.

 

[dirty_rotten_squatter]

What is this consent crap that people keep talking about? I never heard about it.

consent pretty much takes place of the word "permission" for example if I wanted to sit next to you or hug you first, I'd say.."do I have your consent to sit next to you" or "do I have your consent to hug you" that kind of shit.

 

[veggieguy12]

I've never encountered shit that strict and it almost sounds exaggerated by the critics. But even what I have heard - in the extreme cases - has been ridiculous.
But I guess the idea is cool? Conversely, why wouldn't we operate on a system of making objections more directly and confidently: "Hey, don't hug me, I have scabies!" or "Hey, please don't sit there, I want that hottie to sit by me so I can get some action".
Action is a code word, in that example. (You know, code for what.)
Really this is not what CrimethInc. is essentially about, so the thread should move on or cease.

 

[seke]

no I mean, how does asking for consent have anything at all to do with crimethinc?

 

[gangleri]

Crimethinc emphasizes the use of consent. Which is badass and the basic concept behind the opposition to oppression. People oppress other people when they do things to them without their consent. And when there are no more cops consent will be pretty vital to having a society thats not fucked up.

vg12: I don't think more confidently objecting would really work as well as it sounds. And it shouldn't be the role of the person who is being acted upon to object, really. There are a lot of factors which don't allow people to object or defend themselves sufficiently. Like physical/emotional strength, gender roles, types of privilege, and so on.

 

[dirty_rotten_squatter]

I've never encountered shit that strict and it almost sounds exaggerated by the critics. But even what I have heard - in the extreme cases - has been ridiculous.
But I guess the idea is cool? Conversely, why wouldn't we operate on a system of making objections more directly and confidently: "Hey, don't hug me, I have scabies!" or "Hey, please don't sit there, I want that hottie to sit by me so I can get some action".
Action is a code word, in that example. (You know, code for what.)
Really this is not what CrimethInc. is essentially about, so the thread should move on or cease.

Nope def not over exaggerated, if anything under. I sat next to this girl at the convergence and she got pissed off that I didnt ask consent! I totally agree about the if you dont want it just say no. It may not be what crimethinc is "about" but it is a significant factor so I disagreee that it should move on.

 

[dirty_rotten_squatter]

vg12: I don't think more confidently objecting would really work as well as it sounds. And it shouldn't be the role of the person who is being acted upon to object, really. There are a lot of factors which don't allow people to object or defend themselves sufficiently. Like physical/emotional strength, gender roles, types of privilege, and so on.

I disagree that it shouldnt be the role of the person to object. If that person isnt emotionally strong enough to say dont sit next to me or get away, why are they in the activist scene if they cant even speak up for themselves? I say the activist scene, because this is the only place I have ever seen consent in action.

 

[gangleri]

There are a lot of people with a considerable amount of energy to contribute to activist/radical community that have difficulty with those kinds of situations (for example, victims of sexual assault). I certainly agree that we should all aspire to be strong as hell, but not everyone is there yet, and if we're building a movement thats going to take care of its own, we can't allow our people to be exploited, assaulted, harassed, etc, and then blame them for not saying no.

Some people take it way too far and it becomes a hindrance to everyday social interaction. This is annoying, and I'm not trying to defend it.

If you feel like you're strong enough to stand up for yourself, help those who don't. Also: white males don't always have a balanced perspective on issues of consent, privilege, class, etc, so imagine how, for example, a queer person of color would perceive the issue of consent in a society that is inherently antagonistic towards them.

All I'm saying is, if we're going to talk about solidarity with the oppressed and such, we've gotta walk the walk in everyday life. How you interact with people on an individual basis is more important than how ready you are for insurrection, or how much you hate the cops, cause without the social element, we're not too different from the other kind of libertarians.

p.s. sorry for being so wordy all the time. i get worked up.

 

[gangleri]

sorry, this goddamn computer keeps double posting.

 

[Beegod Santana]

If you can't stand up for yourself or don't have the balls to talk back to the people who piss you off then world is gonna walk all over you. I don't care about your past, being a little wimp is no way to get things done. If you can't muster up the courage to ask someone not to sit next to you, how the FUCK do you expect to take on a government who is more than willing to kill anyone who threatens it?

I know this is gonna piss a few people off, but seriously, don't be such a fucking pussy. Live by example, I never seem to meet any of these people in the ghetto where help is really needed and there's plenty of people really pissed at the government. However it seems like you can't throw a stone in se pdx without hitting 5 crimethInc kids.

 

[dirty_rotten_squatter]

Word to ya motha son! Nuff said.

 

[veggieguy12]

If you can't stand up for yourself... then world is gonna walk all over you. I don't care about your past, being a little wimp is no way to get things done. If you can't muster up the courage to ask someone not to sit next to you, how the FUCK do you expect to take on a government who is more than willing to kill anyone who threatens it?

Well I agree with that, it's just that we don't need to be inconsiderate (or maybe that is good for developing our defenses and assertion) in order to be assertive.

I agree with Gangleri that we can ask, but I also think people need to not expect that everyone will be considerate, just as you don't expect every dog to sniff you rather than bite; in either case, we need to be prepared to survive beyond the lack of friendliness.

 

[finn]

I think it's not too much to ask to sit next to someone, that's all fine, but people have to be careful that being considerate doesn't turn into such an elaborate etiquette that it becomes a power game. The same thing goes for security culture. (For history nerds elaborate etiquette was how Louis XIV controlled his court.) I personally haven't found crimethinc to do this, but instead isolated pockets of activists unaffiliated with them.