Queer Identity, Dating Apps, Etc....

Bey

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#1
Since @Matt Derrick has graciously included a Relationship section on StP, I'll add some random thoughts:
(This is also inspired by the recent thread of the Great Suicide Rider himself, @Coywolf )
Personally, I have struggled with certain problematic elements prevalent in, particularly, online interactions between Queer men, et al. (MSM, etc.) There is, famously, a reductionist quality to much of the dating dynamic in our milieu; and I think it's self-evident that dating apps are, if not a sufficient cause, then, at least, an efficacious concomitant of this experience. My own approach to forming connections with people (of all genders) has always taken the route of building affinity through conversation, the exchange of ideas; what could be called a sapiosexual praxis...However, on certain platforms, a type of, let's say, "fuck now, talk later" tendency prevails. I want to hasten to add that this is not a criticism of casual sex or even a "fuck now, skip talking altogether" approach if that's what two ( or more) people desire. Having been active in Polyamory circles (and polycules) for years, I have seen many styles and configurations work (and, yes, seen many go down in flames). I only, of course, wish to convey my own philosophical approach. I'm becoming convinced that dating apps (or online interaction, generally?) is not terribly conducive to a more personalist road to connection. Any analysis or feedback is very welcome...
-Bey
 

Honey Crust

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#2
I think the rise of dating/hookup apps is a product of both capitalism’s oppressive individualistic philosophy and the continued demand for the nuclear family (read: economically efficient familiar unit).

Because most of us can’t afford to start a family in the current economical climate, and because the cis-hetero-patriarchal family unit is still being marketed to us as the only viable familiar connection we have for our futures, a lot of people are feeling lonely and isolated from actual genuine human contact without the underlying finacial motivations that capitalism requires of us.

This has pushed human intimacy into not an exploration of the other person and ourselves, but instead into neat little intimacy appointments that are to serve as substitute for that connection, and are thus profitable and marketable.

This, as it relates to queer relationships, especially that of MLM or MSM, is very prominent. For decades, we’ve had drilled into our brains through legislation, through societal prejudice, and through internalized self-hatred, that queer families couldn’t or shouldn’t exist, and so we tried to find connection through hookups in underground clubs, in parties, in secret meet ups. It’s very easy to see how decades of that being pushed into the queer community still affects how we try to find intimacy through hookups, just now you have access to whole communities through apps like Grindr or hornet or tinder.

Once you take into account how being denied a genuine search for a familiar partner(s) was taken away from queer folks through institutionalized homophobia, it’s not hard to make the connection that the same thing is happening to other folks (namely, straight people now) through economic disparity.
 
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#6
dunno i kinda think grindring and that sort of thing has been overall positive for me. met some cool people i never would've otherwise.
 
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Bey

Bey

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#7
dunno i kinda think grindring and that sort of thing has been overall positive for me. met some cool people i never would've otherwise.
True! I've met good folk as well...I think my overall point is not so much that Grindr, etc., is purely negative, but that it is inherently limiting...
 
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#8
yeah but then life is inherently limiting cos you can only meet who you meet over when and however long you live.
 
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Bey

Bey

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#9
39048319_1836378616455563_5351540576644759552_o-jpg.48954_Queer Identity, Dating Apps, Etc...._Sex & Relationships_Squat the Planet_12:44 PM
As a visual aid, my last polycule. I'm last row, center, with the suspenders; my partner is the one with the Technicolor hair....
 

Honey Crust

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#10
dunno i kinda think grindring and that sort of thing has been overall positive for me. met some cool people i never would've otherwise.
It’s not so much Grindr itself, but moreso the culture that surrounds it, I think. I met my most recently acquired partner on Grindr, and the first time we met we spent and hour and a half just talking, and then parted ways for the night. It’s a tool, but like any tool, it only works out if you learn to use it correctly.
 
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#11
dunno seems less like queer problems and more like adapting to modern technology problems to me.

(if i'm coming across like arguementative thats really not my intention, i think i've clearly had a way different experience)
 
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roughdraft

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#12
I think the rise of dating/hookup apps is a product of both capitalism’s oppressive individualistic philosophy and the continued demand for the nuclear family (read: economically efficient familiar unit).

Because most of us can’t afford to start a family in the current economical climate, and because the cis-hetero-patriarchal family unit is still being marketed to us as the only viable familiar connection we have for our futures, a lot of people are feeling lonely and isolated from actual genuine human contact without the underlying finacial motivations that capitalism requires of us.

This has pushed human intimacy into not an exploration of the other person and ourselves, but instead into neat little intimacy appointments that are to serve as substitute for that connection, and are thus profitable and marketable.
i think you're onto something here,it's just more "shepherding", in a sense, or social engineering, right?
 

Prometheus

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#13
It’s not so much Grindr itself, but moreso the culture that surrounds it, I think. I met my most recently acquired partner on Grindr, and the first time we met we spent and hour and a half just talking, and then parted ways for the night. It’s a tool, but like any tool, it only works out if you learn to use it correctly.
I have to agree here to a certain extent, Grindr and other apps are tools than can be used for both positive and negative outcomes though definitely born from capitalist hetero-patriarchy and its insistence on traditional nuclear-stye relationships. My biggest problem personally has been meeting and connecting with people in either the queer community and the travelling community as a gay man and not being judged and alienated from either end, such as "He's a dirty hippie kid, we can't hookup or hangout" or "He's a homosexual, he'll hit on us or look at us sexually, so we can't travel together"...therefore being ostracized from both cultures. All in all, it's highly disillusioning travelling and using queer dating apps for me. Though, I as well, have met some really awesome people through them.
 

EphemeralStick

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#14
My biggest problem personally has been meeting and connecting with people in either the queer community and the travelling community as a gay man and not being judged and alienated from either end, such as "He's a dirty hippie kid, we can't hookup or hangout" or "He's a homosexual, he'll hit on us or look at us sexually, so we can't travel together"...therefore being ostracized from both cultures.
Boy-fucking-howdy if you didn't just take the words right out of my mouth.

I find grindr to be a tool, as others have stated. It has definitely commodified meeting people for sexual encounters in a way that cis-hets don't really have access to. It comes in handy when i'm in a new city, I'll usually jump on and hit up a few guys that sound interesting with the intention of finding good conversation.

I've chatted up so many different kinds of men all over the country with it, all while barely using it to hook up. (I prefer using adam4adam for those) It's become a device I use to feel less lonely when theres no one else to talk to, kinda like how old school IRC chatting used to be.

I'm also pretty obvious about my life in my profile, which tends to weed out pricks and fetishists. If I had a nickel for everytime some random dude invited me to live with him I'd be set for life.

To summarize; fuck Grindr, but also fuck yea Grindr.
 
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Prometheus

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#15
Question though...
Do ya'll send pics (such as on Grindr) when requested or wait until you know someone personally, and how has this affected your ability to use such apps?
 

EphemeralStick

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#16
Question though...
Do ya'll send pics (such as on Grindr) when requested or wait until you know someone personally, and how has this affected your ability to use such apps?
What I do now is if someone asks for more pics i'll ask them to send pics of themself of what they wanna see.

A selfie for a selfie, chest pic for chest pic. That sort of thing. That way i'm not just throwing dick pics out there at random. Not that i've ever did that; unsolicited dick pics are obnoxious.

Totally kosher if its politely requested though haha.

Granted, if i'm not enjoying the person i'm talking to i'll just flat out say no to them. After all, my body my rules.


Pic exchange hasn't affected my use of the apps much. Ive been using hook up sites since xy.com was still a thing so I'm hella used to it.
 
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#17
not all the time but not never.

if someone asks for a pic straight away i send them one of dick van dyke. i find it weeds out the people i'm not gonna get on with lol. i generally like to talk to people for a while before i'd do anything though.
 
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#18
This coming from someone who has never used a dating app. Just wanted to weigh in...

When I'm around friends who use the apps, from my perspective I see a lot of wrapped up / exaggerated emotion on either pre-empting the next move of another, creating an idealistic view in their mind about how they'd like things to play out (or maybe it's how it's been presented to them, sometimes not entirely accurately) ... I've just seen a lot of time wasted uncertainly to-ing and fro-ing, (that's just in my opinion) and a lot of disappointment... It's never nice to see friends upset!

It's not going to be the same in all cases, of course - I guess I'm more of a fan of allowing things to happen organically!
 
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