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Real Anarchists Don't Breed

joaquim33

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And also, with the more music and art about freight trains that comes out about trains, the more idiots will emerge that want to ride trains. So I don't know.
i think that's a pretty silly statement, considering that after love and death, freight trains are one of the most canonized fixtures in the american musical repertoire. and anyway, plenty of train riders are complete idiots, and such aforementioned emerging people would be better off learning to hop trains from some silly 16 year kid's goofy folk punk song than mentoring with some train core oogle.
 

acrata4ever

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ted kaczynski volunteered to take cia acid in mkultra tests. 1954 cia document says he very well could have been a sleeping agent (manchurian canidate). camilos parents were anarchists, his agrian reform for cuba shows his parents influence. abbie hoffmans son is an anarchist. yes your parents hope you will be a carbon copy of the assholes they are. these chances are 50/50. ANARCHY MEANS NO RULERS/BOSSES NOT NO RULES/LAWS. the chinese culturally like the japanese have a problem rebelling, blind obedience is the way it works there. it was a bitch for mao to get the following he did and took alot of brainwashing. yes youre going to use in life, i use less i believe less is more. most babies are mistakes you are responsible for your mistakes. please be very responsible.
 
E

Earth

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No, there isn't...

There has to be a balance.
Not everything needs to be developed, certain areas's need be wild and uninhabited
so that other forms of life can live there own way.

I can't understrand why some / acrually many feel that every God damned square inch of country here
needs a person on it.
No, it don't....

People need to stay out from the wildlands,
or else everything will be just one big ghetto......
While some may find that cool,
it ain't fair to the life forms that have no say in the matter.

Manson once said that 200 million need to go,
as far as people are concerned...

With the way so called civilized life is going,
I'd have a hard time disagreeing.........................

We are a part of nature, not apart from nature.
 
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( I just took my dog out for a nice walk in the night air )

But, to comment on the original thing here at hand - breeding vs not - my own personal views have shifted greatly over the past twenty years.

For a long time, I was completelty against it - then in 1995 I was paired up with a wonderful woman who I would have had a family with, except she chose to end her life sooner rather than later.
(this was during my newly post Official Hoologans / Adam-12 CT / NY hardcore life...)

But towards the end of the 90s, I was blessed with being a part of another wonderful woman who was actually a mom, with two boys (11, 13) and I fell into an instant family which I truly adored - until her complaints about me going to NYC for session work (I played electric bass back then) got to be too painful....

Today I am older and broken, and oddly enough for the first time really wishing I had kids of my own.
But I don't, and there's nothing I can do to change that.

Now,
in reference to the comment I just made before this one - I am not being a jerk...

I sincerely do believe that life today is completely out of balance, that there are way too many people - especially bad people - whose greed is ruining it for everyone....

The very last time I got drunk, I listend to the entire Marvin Gaye record (yes, record as in that snap crackle and pop) What's Going On and really became quite distraught over all the words to the music, because today - this record actually stands even stronger than it did back in the early 70s...

There's no jobs, no hope..... I'm so glad I don't have to do it all over again...
- and the only people doing anything positive today (those in all the OCCUPY movements wherever they may be) are being rediculed beyond belief BECAUSE THE PROTESTS SPEAK THE TRUTH !

I do know one thing though, and that's
if I should ever find the right woman, preferably one with a kid - or thinking of adopting one - my life will finally be complete.
 

oki

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people should do what they want, as long as i dont have to have any kids.
its a personal choice, and anarchism means freedom so anarchism that forbids having children is facist.
 

sideshowbxb

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we discussed that me and my soon to be husband . He said wouldn't it be funny if our kids grew up to be gangsters i told him that I wouldn't pay for there shit (gangster kids are expensive). Then he said what if they rebel by becoming hardcore Christians i just laughed. I'm not an anarchist I would love to believe that anarchism would save the human population but the truth is it's contradictory. Even with anarchy there would have to be set law set rules it may not be like the government we have now but it would still be us governing people. People "who do not bare leadership skills" would turn to the ones who do, we evolved from ape's which are pack animals. I think with out everything that people have grew so use to we would fall back to a primal stature.

There are rules with in a pack there are rules with in a family. There is structure to survival and a need to survive no matter how much we suppress these needs they are still embedded into our genes. If no one had kids because it was "rebelling" to not conform to society then you would be conforming by having abortions birth control buying these things to make it so much harder for you not to beckon to your primal responsibility to reproduce. I said this to a few people "going green" is the new black soon enough it will fall out of fashion. being political falls into this same category it's the new in thing to do. Everything has a fashion to it sooner or later no one will care we might care about organic D.I.Y shit our children might even care but who says they wont rebel against us as we rebelled against our parents and our parents rebelled against there's. There is no saving humanity unless we go straight into primativism and god knows that, that's not going to happen.
Thats my theory on the mess
Who says you have to own all the latest gadgets to have children. It's like people telling me i have to do my taxes or own a house car phone or computer that's the social norm if i choose to not be part of it then let it be

We all conform one way or another
on that note, what would snake do? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ed6Yr81jZ6g
 

billyriot

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I don't agree with a lot of what vhemt said, but I can understand where they are coming from, as far as population density goes. The part that offended me most was "good parents make bad anarchists". I wholeheartedly hate that line. I've known anarchists to make great parents, better parents than most Statists. Simply because one chooses to procreate shouldn't take away from how they view the world around them, that's absurd and thoughts like that create coercive behaviour.

And all this talk of "real" anarchists? What does it take to be a "real anarchist"? I simply thought having the ideals that I have, and wanting to apply those ideals to my life, would constitute as anarchistic in one form of the word, but apparently not. Deciding what is and is not for other people's lives is completely contradicting to an anarchistic viewpoint.
 

Mei

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I feel like going as far as to say "real anarchists don't breed" is to place very rigid social controls on people. To call oneself an anarchist and at the same time tell people not to have any children is self contradictory.

How about "if you can't feed em don't breed em" as a general suggestion?
 

3rdEyeVision

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I think any list of why you should have kids can easily be destroyed with logic by a list of why you shouldn't have kids. Just don't have kids. Period. It doesn't matter where you come from or what you believe. We just need to stop having fuckin kids.
 

Odin

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I think only those who are capable of raising intelligent... sane... well adjusted children should have children...

now lets take a census of who on this planet is capable of that.
 

thapoet

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what bettern soldiers than the ones you make yourself? lol... sorry, had to lighten this thread up a little bit.... but seriously, as a rational being, I would agree, but as a caring father, I have to say that my daughter is the best my life has to offer this world.... and she can shoot a fly off a plate o' grits at 60 yards with a 22.... but then again, we are not true anarchists. personally, since i know that everything i say and do, everywhere i sleep, damn near every choice I make in the name of personal freedom is deemed illegal in some fashion, I instead consider myself a "fuckemallist".... bcause quite frankly, i don't give a shit about their rules or the rule of havimg no rules.... when anarchists dictate what others should or shouldn't do, then they seem to be no better than those in power... i was born free because i say i am free, not because governments give me freedom... and when someone tells me i shouldnt have kids because it doesn't fit their agenda, well, whats the difference.... i could never subscribe to communo-anarchism... the belief that everyone must live their lives for the betterment of society. or the safety of the planet... or to save the deer... fuck that! serve that deer up slow roasted on a spit over an open fire while society sits there hating me for not being vegan or some shit.... anyway, the point is this, its not necessarily whether or not you have kids, its what freedom you intill in their hearts that inevitably make the world a free and better place.... wow... i was ranting.... sorry yall, imgots nothingnbut love, yall know this :)
 
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Mongo

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anarchy is a form of policy that we apply to ourselves and sometimes try to coerce others into based on what we believe is right.

having children is a basic part of nature.

that being said, you can be an anarchist and be a good parent.

as for the overpopulation argument, nature or we take care of the population, be it a pandemic, nuclear bomb, asteroids, or even a blackholes can wipe us out at any second.

final summation fuck it, have kids do whatever you want, if your gonna try to stop me arguing
I'll just walk away and if it comes down to it I'll put a boot in your face if anyone trys to physically stop me from having a kid. just try to keep everything as decent as possible while you can on your own personal terms without inhibiting others.
 

Kamil

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Anarchism has nothing to do with the absence of laws, the chief fallacy in the popular conception of anarchism is that it means "no rules". Anarchism literally means no leaders. In fact, the classic anarchist theorists like Bakunin wrote extensively about how people would take up a general sort of natural honour code (for want of a better term) that replace the need to be policed. The existance of "rules", which, in a stateless society would differ dramaticlly in conception, articulation, and application from the rules of bourgeois statist society, does not imply that said community is restrained in its liberty. Rather, they would instead be rendered essential truisms, axiomatic if you will. Sorry for tangent and I didnt mean talk down to anyone or anything. "Whats right and whats wrong?" is a question we will be unable to ask in the future language of global stateless society as it will be replaced by a rational, scientific empathy for all life. And it is with this in mind, that the problem of family and by extension overpopulation must be examined.

There is an essential difference, in my opinion, between organic and inorganic familial relations. Under the material conditions of a market economy and the political monopoly of the financier/businessmen caste, which promotes a cut throat ethos the relations between people blood related all too easily become strained and artificial. There is an honest difference between genuinly loveing someone you are blood related to because of who they are as a person and what theyve done for you, and "loving" someone begrudgingly "just because their family".

Tribal and so called "primitive" societies from what I've seen, postulate (at least in theory) a much more warm, heart-affirming, and honest code of familial interaction. though it certainly does retain flaws in some cases. So-called tribal societies are not a blanket: some are patriarchial, some are not; some are encouraging of the youth, others repressive. Dare I say, sometimes its downright reactionary (FGM, unconsensual marriages), but in general, in its bonding communial ritualism valueable lessons can be gleamed from it.

Contrariwise, the alienation felt by humans in the technologically advanced first world, allows us to reconsider previously held notions though at the same time it is the springboard for this. In the nuclear family unit the wife is subserviant and the children are property. In our first world alienation we can readily see this and thus disregard emopty notions of sanctity in subserviance. Monogamous relationships, caretaking and personal loyalty to ones parents and kin is not inherintly oppresive, but often the conditions of modern technological society make it so.

Just as Marx (obviously not an anarchist but I love em anyways) proposed for the workers to take ahold the reigns of the state (which he defined as a the tool of class oppression) to overthrow, punish, and erase the exploiters; so too can the family structure be re-taken, subverted, and used to our own ends by those of us who are "progressive, nomadic, off the grid" or whatever term you wish to use. This subverted street family would take nods from the tribal model in its various forms while cheerfully and ironically embracing and thus dashing to bits stereotypical elements of the bourgeois family unit.
 
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ancienttoes

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i think children in this capitalist society creates a lot of obligations and ties a lot of people to the operation of the system. could you do what you now and just dumpster some extra food for your baby? maybe. but would you in reality if you had another option like the warm comfort of security that capitalism offers now that another smaller, more vulnerable human being is involved? there are enough people that everyone who could should consciously decide not to make another person. also, the reason parenting is so burdensome is that we no longer have a tribe where everyone takes care of everyone. the reason there are so many people though is not from decision but from fossil fuels and petrochemical fertilizer-induced high yields.
 

shabti

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the existence of voluntarists/anarcho-capitalists should prove that there is no way to make a set of beliefs that "real" anarchists hold. Even those with a propensity to fight hierarchy and politics in all it's forms (an, archy, literally, 'against hierarchy') willingly and knowingly engage in it from time to time. I bought some peanut butter at walmart this morning for example.

yeah. "Here's why I don't think anarchists should breed." is a title that might make me want to read what this dude had to say.
 

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