On Selling Out (1 Viewer)

Older Than Dirt

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Punk is about active resistance, isn't it? Then why are so many of us content with passive hatred?
Yes, this says a lot i was trying so say, but much more briefly.

Except i would just add (repeating the exact same shit i said before, as old people tend to do), so many are doing this "crustpunk 'i am a filthydirty trainkid!' Outside of society is where i wanna be!" [a 1970s Patti Smith quote, BTW] thang in what often looks to an old guy like a very narrow range of ways.

There is a lot of fashion and conformity within dirty kid culture that is not so "punk" in my opinion, and this thread nails that thing, as the OP feels tension between what they want to do, and conforming to this culture of being a "punk" in this certain narrowly defined way.

Anti-fashion fashion, sure, but that doesn't mean conforming to it makes anyone cool, anymore than having the right golf or tennis clothes at the country club does.

At least they aren't pretending to be cool rebels by conforming at the country club.

[EDIT ADDED: Just to be clear, i love the shit out of you kids, and you got a lot of good things going. If Jesus gave me a blowjob, i would complain about his teeth, that's just the way i am.]
 
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We sell all kinds of other stuff in our Etsy store!

Older Than Dirt

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Ian Mackaye was 18-9 when he wrote this song about not fitting in with his white stoner peers in the DC high schools, of course it is kind of what invented straight-edge which i am not and have never been or wanted to be, and that 's not why i'm posting it- it's about being who you are, and fuck them. Whoever "they" are.


But is still is a pretty classic statement of being WHO THE FUCK YOU ARE, not who your peers (in this case), or ANYONE ELSE wants you to be.

Us non-XXX kids on the LES in NYC in the early days of NYHC (talking '80-86) used to use terms like "bent edge", "crooked edge", "curved edge", "jagged edge" but we dug this song too.

There is "Youth Rebellion", and then there's the lifetime kind, which requires changing when you are not a youth anymore, but it turns out the revolution is not victorious quite yet, and you are not the kind who checks out 'til victory...


Or you can do that "Live Fast, Die Young, Leave a Poopy-Pants Corpse" if you think that's cool.

Here is another Minor Threat song about getting old as a punk.

 

Gulysses3

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I’ve been wanting another tattoo to remind myself to “just live” and not make something as simple as living more complex than it needs to be. Do what your soul compels you to do. As long as you treat others and the environment with respect, you can’t go too far wrong. Selling out would be doing something you know hurts others, just to make a buck. Having a home, maybe a family, isn’t selling out, after all, how many of us would exist without parents that gave us food and shelter?
 

Ponyboy

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Brother. All of of us around these parts are intricately aware of the things of which you speak. As for myself I accept that.. At 40 years old. The mathematical impossibility of 'The System' continuing to serve the people's wants and needs, Let alone in my life, But my children's or Grandchildrens life forces me to live off the grid. To prepare a better way. The obvious way😎
 

Breck

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Do what you feel is right. Fuck everyone else... 45 and going back to traveling cuz every place sux so I might as well see the sights before I die...never let em grind you down..friends included
 

r3yn

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OP (Satanic Botanic), this is a very poignant topic. Relevant to my mental interests. I've been debating it through the lens of my life choices these past years.

I think that punk meta-ethos of "not conforming, even to punk non-conformity" is paradoxical but the right way of being.

As long as you treat others and the environment with respect, you can’t go too far wrong. Selling out would be doing something you know hurts others, just to make a buck.
Yeah, that's it, isn't it? As in, that's the basic tenet for being -- the essential idea. Similar to the golden rule. Maybe throw in the Kantian imperative, as an absolute measure: "do that which you would want everyone to do"

And take action. Like mentioned in this thread, don't give in to apathy and inaction. It might be cliche at this point, but I really do believe it wholeheartedly, and tell the people who will listen what Gandhi said: "BE the change you want to see in the world".
 

WyldLyfe

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Could type more but all im gonna say is look at nature, look at creation, what is the intention within creation you see? because there is an intention within creation.

There is an intent within creation and it is aligned to the greater good. It is not neutral. It is aligned to a higher intent and that intent is wanting for consciousness to evolve to higher levels, that is how it comes to know itself, therefore creation wants freedom, possibility, knowledge, higher states of complexity, evolutionary progress and growth is what creation desires.

Growth, change, evolution, so if you give yourself some label like "crustie" "punk" ect.. and think this is me and thats it, and hold onto it, how can you grow an transform like a caterpillar into a butterfly? The old must go for the new life to come, death an rebirth, the phoenix bird.

 
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Groundscore

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Go and do what makes YOU happy. I don't view it as "selling out" if you're listening to your heart/soul/gut.

Maybe see if you can strike a balance between a home life with work and travel.

If you decide to make any major change in your lifestyle maybe try wading in first to see if it's for you, as the last thing you want is to get stuck in a life full of regrets and "what if's."
 

Fuzzypeach

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Oh the struggle is real! I would alternate between dropping out and selling out. I always felt like a whore going to work for "Da man". But then again there were times I did like it. Unfortunately, the choices are stark: Either be in Babylon, working for "Da man" or be a disinfranchised wandering bum. Of course society is set up like that to keep you paying tribute to the Lord's of Babylon.

To have another choice is what people have been striving for with communes ( now "intentional communities"). However, getting one going is difficult largely because people cannot agree on what it's supposed to look like. It seems the religious ones are the only ones that are successful in large numbers. I think that's because we are all so fragmented. The internet is helping to bring like minded people together, but then we are all so scattered as well.

I have been searching for a better way most of my life. I am fortunately retired which makes things easier for me personally, but I would love to see a system that didn't force you to wait until you are too old and or sick to be sovereign. I guess the best solution for now is to go in and out of the lifestyle as your needs change.
 

Stiv Rhodes

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This is a great conversation, and a difficult dilemma that I think most street kids have to face as we age. The ones who don't usually end up drugged out zombies living on the edge of death. Depression, isolation and addiction are common problems on the road as well as in mainstream society. I've gotten a lot from traveling and would recommend the activity to most young people, but I don't think it makes much of a life. I use to be the only member of my old crew that worked a "regular" job, now I'm the only one left that's still squatting a house, and the only one that ever bought property. I still go on a trip once or twice a year, but I get tired of being on the road after a couple weeks. It seems like a lot of us have a disdain for the superficiality of the cities, but they have always been where we found each other. If there was an easy answer, we'd all be doing it already. Life will always be work, weather it's holding a job or carrying your drinking water by foot. Rather than commit to one or the other, I prefer to do a little bit of each.
 

Dameon

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This dilemma is an old one, for sure. SLC Punk addressed it to some extent; at a certain point either you have to decide whether you're going to let the lifestyle kill you or turn you insane, or whether you're going to "sell out". Living a wild and free lifestyle has a price, and the older you get the higher that price gets. Your teeth start rotting in your mouth because you don't get proper dental care, your health goes to shit because you can't see a doctor (free clinics are shit and don't count). You get sick of watching your friends die of drinking and overdoses, or lose their mind because they got fed too much acid at a festival. Your dog gets old and can't walk 20 miles in a day anymore, assuming your dog doesn't get a major problem and get put down because you can't afford a vet, or get taken away because you went to jail for too long.

I had to switch to an apartment and a 9-5 after 5 years of traveling + 3 years on a boat + 2 years living out in the woods, and it's definitely a hard transition. My time isn't my own anymore, the lack of freedom is real and painful. Every other week I'm about ready to say "fuck it", get rid of it all, and put the pack on again. The only thing that keeps me going is that I'm doing all this so I can have real freedom, rather than constantly trying to scrape up tiny amounts of cash so I can meet basic needs, and not really being able to see the world because you need money to leave the country. It also makes me feel really good finally getting long-needed dentistry done, and being able to go to a real doctor who actually gives a shit about me (versus a free-clinic nurse who doesn't even look at me).

Either we sell out, or we die from some stupid accident on the road, or we die old and alone of some stupid preventable illness with a mouth full of rotten teeth living in third-world conditions, the way I see it.
 

Juan Derlust

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Long as I got something to sell, let the bidding begin! Most folks don't want to bust their ass for dismal wages, some folks expect something for nothing, all of us gotta eat - everyone operates somewhere in that range. I think @MFB quoted something somewhere about righteous indignation ain't nothing but jealousy wearing a halo...
 

Brodiesel710

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Those of us who grew up without direction, or meaning in our young lives hit the road to find it. Then at some point, we become enslaved by the freedom we found. Ultimately we want to be successful and achieve things, but find ourselves settling with subsistent living, through survival tactics we learned on the road. As we watch our community grow and change, we question our own decisions and future. SELL OUT OR DIE!!!!!!!!!!
 

Mj23

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it really just wears on the body. bottom line. and looking over your shoulder for the law 24:7 can be just as soulsucking as working at mcdonalds.

i just turned thirty and im still trying to find the groove. ultimately i want a home, though. soil to build upon, keep tools and create with.. thats my dream. would def be in college too if it were practical.

you kind of just get tired. very, very tired.
 

Juan Derlust

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When we're less experienced, we confuse freedom with unaccountability. Gained experience distilled into a little wisdom will reveal it's not about choosing whatever path right or wrong, but forging a right path (for you) and adapting yourself to it.

Not really applicable for sociopaths or psychotics, however
 

Mj23

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right.

its saddening when you begin to realize a lot of them are out there to be addicts and not to improve on themselves as people and really learn and grow. bc for me thats what getting away from the norm — 9 to 5 and pharmaceuticals — was all about. about finding real human integrity and real family to build something beautiful with.

..not applicable, however, for socio/psychopaths.. 100%.
 
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