# The oldest fairy tale known to date



## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 8, 2019)

The Bible!!!

Since theres no religion section... Which Im totally fine with by the way.... A world without religion, is what I would call, a big step in the right direction.... Ill just leave this here.

You have to wonder if people feel stupid after someone they knew dissapears. Them, their friends and their whole family get on tv begging and pleading for people to pray about it. Pray that their loved one be returned safely. And eventually the whole world gets to see how much good it did them to pray, when they find the person brutally murdered and tossed along side the highway.. Do they feel stupid for going on public television, asking random people to pray to an invisible man that doesnt exist... Thinking that somehow it would change a real life situation.

This is 2019 for fucks sake! We live in the modern world... Havent we evolved past that yet? God damn, havent we grown past the day of ancient fairy tales? Why do people put up with this shit?

I watch a lot of documentaries and everytime someone is raped, strangled, thrown in a river, or burried in a shallow grave, theres no shortage of people, like fuckin nimrods, to get on tv and talk about "well she must be in heaven" or "pray god will bring her home"... Keep telling yourself that morons. Yeah god sure held up his end of the bargain. Get real! WTF?

And how come nobody ever gets on TV and says "He/she was abducted by aliens. The alliens took her to outer space! I guess someday we'll meet again on mars... Why dont you ever hear that? It pisses me off! All the sudden people think they're dillusional...

Why is it that people freely and openly talk about god and heaven and life after death... And nobody tells them how stupid and dillusional they sound.... But some stupid fuck starts talking about alliens and all the sudden, he's the joke of the week.... Neither story is more rediculous than the other, but they're treated differently. Its an injustice within society. Religion should be outlawed and frowned upon.


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## noothgrush (Feb 8, 2019)

You really can't understand why people would need to have something like god to believe in?


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## Deleted member 125 (Feb 8, 2019)

Well I can't wait for the nice comments show up in this thread. To anyone who wants to comment, please remember to keep this shit civil.


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 8, 2019)

If people have nothing better to do than fantasize about imaginary creatures, then good for them... But in real life, to talk and act like its a real thing, is straight up dillusional... Have they done any research? Do they have any idea whats going on in this world? 

I like to imagine and fantasize about being 6'2" muscular, with a hot blonde girlfriend and a furrari.... Does that make it real? NO! Im short, I dont have a six pack and Ill never have enough money to buy a sports car or ride a hot blonde.... So I wouldnt go around talking about it, like its reality in life...


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## noothgrush (Feb 8, 2019)

I don't know you sound awfully upset and concerned about other peoples spiritual beliefs that's all I'm sayin'


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## Deleted member 125 (Feb 8, 2019)

george990 said:


> If people have nothing better to do than fantasize about imaginary creatures, then good for them... But in real life, to talk and act like its a real thing, is straight up dillusional... Have they done any research? Do they have any idea whats going on in this world?
> 
> I like to imagine and fantasize about being 6'2" muscular, with a hot blonde girlfriend and a furrari.... Does that make it real? NO! Im short, I dont have a six pack and Ill never have enough money to buy a sports car or ride a hot blonde.... So I wouldnt go around talking about it, like its reality in life...



Yer right, good for them. 

...ok I'm just gonna go ahead and say it, that second part about the height and good looking girlfriend and sports car sounds like yer upset about a whole lot of other stuff besides religion.


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## Deleted member 20683 (Feb 8, 2019)

First of all, you don’t need to drag the entire bible along when you’re talking about Christianity, they only care about a relatively small and late slice of it. It’s a fascinating work of literature all in all and I would not mind if there was a relevant section...im very interested in things like religion, philosophy and literature tho.

Edit: PS arguably there are no fairies in the Bible anyway considering they are part of Celtic folklore.


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 8, 2019)

Im totally content. To be honest, my life has been better the last 8 months than it has been for the last 8 years... So this isn't a fit of rage or an outlash of bitterness and rebellion...

Let me just say this, you dont experience and see the things Ive seen and done.... And still believe in god... Its just not possible. The older I get, and the more I learn, the further from religion I become... Religion can be proven false on like a hundred different levels... And the more you learn about the real world and whats going on in the world, the more rediculous religion sounds....

In a totally sober moment, with rational thoughts, I respectfulls say to myself "wtf is wrong with people?" Cant they keep their dillusions to themselves? If they believe in mythical dragons, jesus christ, and flying pigs.... Good for you, but dont go around telling the world about that crap. Ya know? Its a mental illness and they should be heavily medicated


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 8, 2019)

oak moth said:


> First of all, you don’t need to drag the entire bible along when you’re talking about Christianity, they only care about a relatively small and late slice of it. It’s a fascinating work of literature all in all and I would not mind if there was a relevant section...im very interested in things like religion, philosophy and literature tho.
> 
> Edit: PS arguably there are no fairies in the Bible anyway considering they are part of Celtic folklore.



Hey dont get me wrong, theres some good and true stuff in the bible. Ive read alot of it.... Theres also true stuff in humpty dumpty, the little red riding hood... Hey the 3 little pigs has a great lesson about the longgevity of building materials.... All 4 have great lessons within, but as a whole....

I like to compare it to a new tool you purchase at home depot... Yea the tool has a purpose, its useful and serves well... But the box and packaging its served up in, is only there to deliver the message.... Same with the bible. Theres useful lessons, and theres wisdom to be learned from proverbs, but a big portion of the bulk is just filler. Alot of it is just there to set the stage. The bible is half wisdom and half horse shit. But you have to be realistic enough to know whats valueable and whats not


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 8, 2019)

You ever openned a box that was shipped thru the mail... Burried in a box of packing peanuts is the part you ordered... Not every packing peanut is a valued treasure! Same with the bible. You have to look past the outrageous bulk of it, to find the valuables. Theres some wise proverbs, but that doesnt mean you should take every detail of the whole story and swear by it.

I dont care what you think, and i dont care what anyone thinks. People have taken religion way too far, and someone should tell them how rediculous they sound. Thats all Im saying


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## Deleted member 125 (Feb 8, 2019)

@george990 I get what yer saying, I really do. Im the farthest from being religious or even a spiritual person as somebody could be. But being that the majority of folks on this website most likely feel the same way about religion as you do it seems like a strange place to lash out about it. Plus these wonderful threads tend to lead to a lot of "fuck you I'm right yer wrong" comments which even though they are just a hoot to read sometimes it's nice not having to ask grown ass adults to be civil about who believes in whatever they wanna believe in.

I for one applaud yer bravery on taking a stand against religion on a website where most of us feel the same way. It's truly inspiring.


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## noothgrush (Feb 9, 2019)

That packing peanut analogy really drives the point home though.


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 9, 2019)

SlankyLanky said:


> @george990 I get what yer saying, I really do. Im the farthest from being religious or even a spiritual person as somebody could be. But being that the majority of folks on this website most likely feel the same way about religion as you do it seems like a strange place to lash out about it. Plus these wonderful threads tend to lead to a lot of "fuck you I'm right yer wrong" comments which even though they are just a hoot to read sometimes it's nice not having to ask grown ass adults to be civil about who believes in whatever they wanna believe in.
> 
> I for one applaud yer bravery on taking a stand against religion on a website where most of us feel the same way. It's truly inspiring.



Well Im glad Im not the only one... And no man, this is a frustration thats been building up for a long time now nd i just needed somewhere to vent for a while. 

And apparently Im friends with the wrong people on facebook. Im so god damn sick of all these, "share this post and god will reveal a miracle in your life" and "type amen if you believe god will take you to heaven"

Im so sick of religious EVERYTHING! I wish people would just drop it and never mention it again! Every single day, I see all this stupid shit about god this, and religion that... I wish they would just keep it to themselves. If nobody ever mentioned god or the bible again, I'd run out of things to complain about.... Well, maybe not... But it'd be a good start.


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## roughdraft (Feb 9, 2019)

george990 said:


> But you have to be realistic enough to know whats valueable and whats not



i hear you on this - we agree there is some valuable content in the literature, in the stories - but when people act as if things can be solved through prayer or simply petition for everyone to 'pray', yeah it is pretty fuckin ridiculous because it's hard to believe it *does* anything and even more importantly- does hardly anyone actually do it?

you know something there was a tornado in Oklahoma, real serious one a whole town all but got put in a bodybag and - i hate to bring this up especially here - but i read one quick news article on it and they got the celebrity twitter shit happening...'prayers for the citizens of this town' and later some guy. not as much a celebrity but still mainstream famous says some shit like 'just want to thank @beyonce and At fuckin so and so for their prayers. All i could send to <town people suffering extra hard> was money' And i thought Talk that shit bro....enough said....

so i don't actually know the bible, aside from a few smidgens right..."forgive those who know not what they do"...."get stoned whilst ye lay with another man"...."why have you forsaken me". I so far in life really don't give a fuck to read the bible, mainly because I can hear the stories from other people and hopefully establish friendship with them and satisfy their need for chat, easy. 

i have never prayed because i think it's just plain ridiculous....but I admit to have some spiritual beliefs, you could say it's akin to the belief in extraterrestrials - I'm chill about my beliefs - it's just like a little bonus in life to me. I'm not raving about it. pressing people on it.

other people definitely blow out of proportion the value of *it all* - but why? Heed these words - the reason is it is a weak and pathetic world. 

people not only....rape and murder each other.....but then there are the loved ones and company who have to deal with the reality of it....people are afraid on so many levels, you know what I'm saying? So they cling to something that makes it all better to escape from their inability to live their lives well and as well cope with the evil bullshit other people do. our society is ass. religion is still a thing because we are still so low grade

it's kinda like self perpetuating viscious cycle, people need religion because we're collectively dense and unwilling to just 'be'- let alone 'be' the best one can be - and it reinforces our/their own technically pathetic way of being. and it's so much worse than that - look at the state of the world, we've got people starving and freezing and cheating each other and wasting their own good fortune - and you wonder why some people want to just shout Christ saves!! and get all caught up in it til there's drool coming off of their lips ?


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## Willis (Feb 9, 2019)

i found the bible to be disappointly lacking in fairies.


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

Holy shit, it's 2018!

I've been living the last 2 months in 2019!

Thanks for the post man.
Otherwise I wouldn't have known I had traveled into the future from January 1st until February 8th!

No thanks man. I think I'll skip out on getting my life advice from someone who doesn't even know what year thier living in.

BTW; God IS an alien ::soapbox::


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

george990 said:


> You ever openned a box that was shipped thru the mail... Burried in a box of packing peanuts is the part you ordered... Not every packing peanut is a valued treasure! Same with the bible. You have to look past the outrageous bulk of it, to find the valuables. Theres some wise proverbs, but that doesnt mean you should take every detail of the whole story and swear by it.
> 
> I dont care what you think, and i dont care what anyone thinks. People have taken religion way too far, and someone should tell them how rediculous they sound. Thats all Im saying



If you don't care what people think, why did you post the thread? You obviously care, or else you wouldn't have bothered.


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 9, 2019)

wISDOMiZdUm said:


> View attachment 48919
> 
> Holy shit, it's 2018!
> 
> ...


Idk about your logic at all. To judge sombodys entirety on a single mistake or typo... This makes sense. entirely too much logic there.


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

BirdDaddy said:


> Idk about your logic at all. To judge sombodys entirety on a single mistake or typo... This makes sense. entirely too much logic there.


Lighten the fuck up and get over yourself


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 9, 2019)

george990 said:


> You ever openned a box that was shipped thru the mail... Burried in a box of packing peanuts is the part you ordered... Not every packing peanut is a valued treasure! Same with the bible. You have to look past the outrageous bulk of it, to find the valuables. Theres some wise proverbs, but that doesnt mean you should take every detail of the whole story and swear by it.
> 
> I dont care what you think, and i dont care what anyone thinks. People have taken religion way too far, and someone should tell them how rediculous they sound. Thats all Im saying



Soooo, I don't like to get into this kind of thing on the web... on the note of taking it to far. There were religions b4 christ there have been some created after. Most were a way to give reason to life, control the masses, hope, teach lessons and morality... the why religion list goes on.... As far as Christianity goes, I have a conspiracy on that. It coinsides with the new world order. Religion was created to form a belief system so government could manipulate the populace with there own moral compass... give reason to genocide, the invasion and conquest of entire continents and forced religion under penilty of law... enforced by a government... given rights by God!!! Does this not sound like word magic? Is this not minde control? How the fuck are ppl so blinde? #george990 you asked how did it go this far? You ask why do alian ubducties not make it to main stream media? I ask you this. Who owns the federal reserv? Who owns the national or federal banks in other nations? Who owns the news stations? Who owns google? What does THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA INCORPORATED mean to you? Why did the revolution happen? Why are all our major government buildings in Washington DC? Why is our national reserv in Washington DC? Who owns Washington DC? What is the UCC (universal commercial code)? What is maritime law? What is the constitution? What is a citizen? What is a pirate? Answer this list and go back to pondering why religion exist so strongly to day and why Christianity is the only religion the USA won't give political refuge for.....


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Feb 9, 2019)

wISDOMiZdUm said:


> Lighten the fuck up and get over yourself



You're not really adding anything here and it doesn't even seem to apply. I agree with what @BirdDaddy said about simple mistakes. You're kind of being ridiculous, everyone knows what year it is. Some of us will still be dating shit 2018 into April and May, it just happens. If anyone needs to "lighten the fuck up" I'd say it oughta be you, trippin on someone accidentally still writing 2018, the year we just got out of. 

@BirdDaddy seems pretty mellow honestly. Then the get over yourself bit? Where's the part where it seems like he's stuck on himself? Did someone tell you to get over yourself recently and you've just been champing at the bit ever since, just dying to throw that same line in the next persons face to make yourself feel a little better even if it hardly applies to anything they've said? That's what's up innit?


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

I was just pointing out the fact that this guy thinks he has it all figured out and he can't even remember what year it is. None of us are perfect, including me. None of us should be taking anyone else's opinions as truth, because we're all shit. Way to jump to hostility folks. The poster was asking for it by posting a rant. You guys just jumped on the bandwagon cause apparently you don't have anything better to do than try to start an argument.


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## Deleted member 23824 (Feb 9, 2019)

I have always been the most open-minded of people.

Untill, of course, you happen to disagree with me and my friends viewpoints. Then, me and my friends agree, it is perfectly fine - in fact it is our duty - to ridicule what you believe, in a most public fashion.

Because, if more of us believe what we believe on a given topic, on a given forum, we must naturally be more correct, right?

Oh, by the way, we love everybody. Until we don’t.


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

george990 said:


> The Bible!!!
> 
> Since theres no religion section... Which Im totally fine with by the way.... A world without religion, is what I would call, a big step in the right direction.... Ill just leave this here.
> 
> ...



Though we may not have the same viewpoints regarding spirituality. I believe we may agree on the fact that humans are fucking stupid. I think mankind is only going to be able to live in " harmony" once we are smart enough to realize how stupid we are. Hahaha.


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 9, 2019)

Believe it or not, I actually like the bible for certain reasons. Theres a ton of wisdom in it and its a good healthy habbit to refresh your memory from time to time....

But to me, the whole story was just the delivery package, for morals and lessons, from old people who were dying, to young people and people who arent even alive yet. Somebody wanted to pass their wisdom along for future generations... But the bulk of the stories are just a way to get the message across. It was a different world back then and yeah a big part of it was to control people.

You have to be selective enough to pull the wisdom out and let the rest go in one ear and out the other.

My whole point is that it is, and always has been far too acceptable to believe and act like every detail of the whole thing is truth... And Im so tired of hearing it. Everywhere you go, everything you see theres some idiot talking about god, asking for prayers, and promoting the thought that an invisible man, floating on a cloud, controlling things, is reality... You see it on interviews, documentaries, the news, facebook and other social media... And it just cracks me up when people who have no idea whats happenned to their friend, or is happenning to their family member, or is going to happen to them, get in front of the camera and act like an imaginary spirit is going to control the outcome of reality... They're almost always proven wrong by real events, yet people continue to talk about it...


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## jimmyf (Feb 9, 2019)

I’m just gonna say if you read the Bible from front to back, then your opinion would change. Doesn’t mean you’ll agree with Christianity, but the Bible predicts a lot of the negative stuff going on in our society today. Some is directly stated, some is through symbolism. 

We’re all entitled to our own opinions and beliefs, but at least educate yourself before trying to tear apart someone else’s... just sayin...


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## Willis (Feb 9, 2019)

i did read the bible front to back. it struck me that a tree must've died for this.


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

There's more to existence than we'll ever know and the more we think we know, the less we'll be open to learning. I consider God the unknown and what is unsoiled by human hands, like Nature and space, as examples. Or the positive aspects of existence. Laughter, love etc. It's Ironic, because God is also knowledge. When you learn, you become closer to your creator. We fuck shit up because we ALL have good and bad qualities. Nothing we do will ever be perfect, including religion. God is in all of us. Like when we manage to be nice to one another. Humans try to put human limitations on God ( guy on cloud judging us all) because they are not evolved enough to comprehend or contemplate something more. God is beyond that. I think God is also individualized. None of us are the same, why would God take one form? But what do I know?


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## noothgrush (Feb 9, 2019)

I think we live in a simulation created by Elon Musk.


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Feb 9, 2019)

I don't think any of us have the slightest clue what god is or isn't. It's all just guesses, nobody knows. Anybody that for sure for sure knows.. is incredibly dead and they ain't tellin us shit. Those who have died and came back talkin bout "heaven is like this" are probably attention seeking nuts. My mom died last year 3 times, the first was in my passenger seat. The next two times in ER. They estimated her to be gone for over 3 minutes when she was in my car and then between paddle shocks she was down some additional time too. My mom is incredibly ill and loves her some Jesus. If anybody wants it to be real, it's her. She said it ain't nothin but black. There's nothing there, it's just over. I tend to believe her if I'm gonna believe anyone. I think it's fine to say "I believe it's like this, or I think god is this certain way" but to say anything with certainty?



wISDOMiZdUm said:


> God is also knowledge. When you learn, you become closer to your creator. God is in all of us. Humans try to put human limitations on God ( guy on cloud judging us all) God is beyond that.



Is god beyond that? Tell us more god facts.


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## Gabriel Pullman (Feb 9, 2019)

Okay news flash .
It's not 2018 anymore 
It's 2019.
I know hard to swallow and it's Feb as well.


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

Engineer J Lupo said:


> I don't think any of us have the slightest clue what god is or isn't. It's all just guesses, nobody knows. Anybody that for sure for sure knows.. is incredibly dead and they ain't tellin us shit. Those who have died and came back talkin bout "heaven is like this" are probably attention seeking nuts. My mom died last year 3 times, the first was in my passenger seat. The next two times in ER. They estimated her to be gone for over 3 minutes when she was in my car and then between paddle shocks she was down some additional time too. My mom is incredibly ill and loves her some Jesus. If anybody wants it to be real, it's her. She said it ain't nothin but black. There's nothing there, it's just over. I tend to believe her if I'm gonna believe anyone. I think it's fine to say "I believe it's like this, or I think god is this certain way" but to say anything with certa
> 
> 
> 
> Is god beyond that? Tell us more god facts.



I have actually died myself. I was struck by a van. It was not a pleasant experience. I'd like to think it was a psychosomatic reaction to the pain I experienced before I " passed " I don't know, science stuff. All I know is I didn't experience a happily ever after. Maybe I burned in hell a little bit. I don't know. Made me grateful to be alive and try to be a better person although I'm probly still a piece of shit.


Engineer J Lupo said:


> I don't think any of us have the slightest clue what god is or isn't. It's all just guesses, nobody knows. Anybody that for sure for sure knows.. is incredibly dead and they ain't tellin us shit. Those who have died and came back talkin bout "heaven is like this" are probably attention seeking nuts. My mom died last year 3 times, the first was in my passenger seat. The next two times in ER. They estimated her to be gone for over 3 minutes when she was in my car and then between paddle shocks she was down some additional time too. My mom is incredibly ill and loves her some Jesus. If anybody wants it to be real, it's her. She said it ain't nothin but black. There's nothing there, it's just over. I tend to believe her if I'm gonna believe anyone. I think it's fine to say "I believe it's like this, or I think god is this certain way" but to say anything with certainty?
> 
> 
> 
> Is god beyond that? Tell us more god facts.





Engineer J Lupo said:


> I don't think any of us have the slightest clue what god is or isn't. It's all just guesses, nobody knows. Anybody that for sure for sure knows.. is incredibly dead and they ain't tellin us shit. Those who have died and came back talkin bout "heaven is like this" are probably attention seeking nuts. My mom died last year 3 times, the first was in my passenger seat. The next two times in ER. They estimated her to be gone for over 3 minutes when she was in my car and then between paddle shocks she was down some additional time too. My mom is incredibly ill and loves her some Jesus. If anybody wants it to be real, it's her. She said it ain't nothin but black. There's nothing there, it's just over. I tend to believe her if I'm gonna believe anyone. I think it's fine to say "I believe it's like this, or I think god is this certain way" but to say anything with certainty?
> 
> 
> 
> Is god beyond that? Tell us more god facts.



I have actually died myself. I was struck by a van. It was not a pleasant experience. I'd like to think it was a psychosomatic reaction to the pain I experienced before I " passed " I don't know, science stuff. All I know is I didn't experience a happily ever after. Maybe I burned in hell a little bit. Who knows. I don't know. Made me grateful to be alive and try to be a better person although I'm probly still a piece of shit.

Apparently, everyone here is permitted to State thier opinion here, other than me without you taking issue. Especially considering the last person to comment joked about the 2018 bit as well and you haven't said shit to them. I've actually had civil banter with the OP and yet you continue to single me out for your ration of shit. Your an almighty moderator. If you take issue with what I have to say, go ahead and delete my account. No skin off my ass. If your what this site is all about, I have no interest anyway. You obviously need it more than I do for validation.


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## Coywolf (Feb 9, 2019)

Huh, I thought this thread would be a heck of alot more philosophical than this by now.

I consider myself a Pagan. I have for a long time. Mainly because I pick things from different religions and put them together into my own. The hard lines in my beliefs is that any sort of organized religion is going to skew actual faith, and that nature and the universe are "God". Not any single entity.

Seriously though, screw organized religion. All of it. From Buddism to Islam to Christianity. It creates a sense of superiority in people, and that is how we get war...and anti-abortion protestors.

However, many lessons can be learned from the texts of all the religions. The Bible, the Koran, The Torah, Greek Mythology, Norse Mythology, ect.

As my Mom told me along time ago:

"Did you know the 'Bible' is a acronym? It stands for 'Basic Instructions Before Leaving Earth'. Dont take it literally."


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## jimmyf (Feb 9, 2019)

Coywolf said:


> Huh, I thought this thread would be a heck of alot more philosophical than this by now.
> 
> I consider myself a Pagan. I have for a long time. Mainly because I pick things from different religions and put them together into my own. The hard lines in my beliefs is that any sort of organized religion is going to skew actual faith, and that nature and the universe are "God". Not any single entity.
> 
> ...



I’m similar to you though I don’t consider myself pagan. However, I don’t fully agree with the superiority, but a large part of me still agrees. 

I believe God wants His followers to be humble and not have the superiority complex. I believe a lot of religions do it in response to Christianity, and because low key, their souls know they haven’t found truth making them overcompensate to a certain extent.

I don’t believe every word of the Bible is truth, but I don’t believe I have the authoritty to decipher true and false for anyone aside from myself. I believe a time will come when others do that. 

Islam is probably the only religion I look at and think, damn, I understand exactly why these people will never want to change their beliefs. The book is legit scary yet contains some rather intelligent points in regards to other religions. However, my thoughts were, just because they can prove everyone else wrong, that does not make them right. 

I also look at God as everything in this world similar to quantum physics not this dude who walked the Earth with a beard and long hair. I just view Him as one giant spirit.


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## roughdraft (Feb 9, 2019)

the one thing i take from Christianity is...to say <I am Christian> should be more an adjective than a noun..so many i think just say 'oh im a Christian because i go to church" but how many of them really act like Christ? which as far as i know, although that is very little, is about sacrificing yourself..resources time etc whatever...for the good of others

@jimmyf do you have any thoughts on this?


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## Deleted member 21367 (Feb 9, 2019)

God is nowhere
God is now here


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## noothgrush (Feb 9, 2019)

GuyWithTwoArms said:


> God is nowhere
> God is now here


Please stop. Your scaring the children.


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## Deleted member 21367 (Feb 9, 2019)

@noothgrush blame philip k dick


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## noothgrush (Feb 9, 2019)

GuyWithTwoArms said:


> @noothgrush blame philip k dick


Which one is that from? I read a scanner darkly and the man in the High tower.


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Feb 9, 2019)

wISDOMiZdUm said:


> Apparently, everyone here is permitted to State thier opinion here, other than me without you taking issue. Especially considering the last person to comment joked about the 2018 bit as well and you haven't said shit to them. I've actually had civil banter with the OP and yet you continue to single me out for your ration of shit. Your an almighty moderator. If you take issue with what I have to say, go ahead and delete my account. No skin off my ass. If your what this site is all about, I have no interest anyway. You obviously need it more than I do for validation.



Settle down, you're not a victim. Nobody is singling you out. You said something I felt wasn't really too cool to BirdDaddy. If you think I'm the only one who feels that way I encourage you to look at the 4 "agree" ratings on my original comment to you. I think we can agree that at least up till there you were coming off kinda douchee right?

Ok so I was cool just ending it there but you come back with some fuck you-nicorn image so I'm like okay I guess we're doing this? I notice you're awfully educated on exactly what god is about so I hit you up with a question. For this I'm an almighty moderator singling you out with a ration of shit... okay.. I'm so sorry you feel attacked. I'll be sure to go easier on you than everyone else, you seem overly defensive/sensitive/fussy.


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## Deleted member 20240 (Feb 9, 2019)

Engineer J Lupo said:


> Settle down, you're not a victim. Nobody is singling you out. You said something I felt wasn't really too cool to BirdDaddy. If you think I'm the only one who feels that way I encourage you to look at the 4 "agree" ratings on my original comment to you. I think we can agree that at least up till there you were coming off kinda douchee right?
> 
> Ok so I was cool just ending it there but you come back with some fuck you-nicorn image so I'm like okay I guess we're doing this? I notice you're awfully educated on exactly what god is about so I hit you up with a question. For this I'm an almighty moderator singling you out with a ration of shit... okay.. I'm so sorry you feel attacked. I'll be sure to go easier on you than everyone else, you seem overly defensive/sensitive/fussy.




I don't want to argue with you. I'm sorry you don't like me or what I do or whatever. I come off as a douche. Okay. Whatever. You can have the last insult. Congratulations your awesome.


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## Deleted member 21367 (Feb 9, 2019)

@noothgrush im not sure entirely but i think it was valis, when he really started loosing his mind. That book was so out there and paranoid it made me uncomfortable just reading it.


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## jimmyf (Feb 9, 2019)

roughdraft said:


> the one thing i take from Christianity is...to say <I am Christian> should be more an adjective than a noun..so many i think just say 'oh im a Christian because i go to church" but how many of them really act like Christ? which as far as i know, although that is very little, is about sacrificing yourself..resources time etc whatever...for the good of others
> 
> @jimmyf do you have any thoughts on this?



Well I'm not Christian, but I believe in the Bible for sure. I believe in the God of the Old Testament and terms of the Old Covenant over the New Covenant. When I read the Bible, I personally didn't think Jesus was perfect. In fact, he was more arrogant than any of the prophets who performed the same miracles on a smaller scale before him. Aside from casting out demons from people, there was someone else who did everything else as well. Also, could you imagine walking into a church and flipping over some tables? Would anyone find it ok to walk into a gay wedding and harass the people celebrating? That's probably the best way I could put that event in today's times. 

Jesus was a little disrespectful towards his mother when he turned water to wine. He spit on mud when healing the blind. He acted like people were stupid for not knowing God was going to multiply their food to feed the masses. Now don't get me wrong, I thought Jesus was cool and definitely sent down by God. I even thought he was kinda funny to be honest. However, just because he could do no wrong in his followers' eyes, it appeared as though he could still do wrong in his Father's Eyes judging by the way he died. I definitely did not think he was God by the way he talked about God in the Gospels. 

My thoughts on Christianity is that Christians have terrorized this world and sadly, it seems there are many who practice hypocrisy. We call the Germans evil for doing to the Jews what we did to the Native Americans. No one talks about that while celebrating Thanksgiving though, and no one talks about what we did to the Japanese during WWII. No one cares about the Muslims in China, yet they care about one journalist who's killed by one of Trump's allies. 

I think trying to follow Christ-like behavior could be considered idolizing just as calling Jesus God could be considered creating a false god. Christianity was started by Greeks and Romans who were previously polytheists who mocked their gods, and it seems as though it carried into Christianity as well. It's prophesied that God would write His Commandments unto the hearts of a group who's never known Him creating a messianic era as the Jews say, but I believe it ended personally. The Jews believe it still hasn't started though. I don't have all the answers, but I've read the Bible twice, and I'm in no rush to finish it a third time. 

There's only one thing I claim to know about God without a doubt, and that is that He is very confusing. Did you know there have been suicide cults from people who try to come up with their own interpretation of the Bible? To be honest, I'm scared of thinking I have it all figured out.


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Feb 10, 2019)

wISDOMiZdUm said:


> Congratulations your awesome.



No way man, _*you're*_ awesome!!!


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## Deleted member 23509 (Feb 10, 2019)

george990 said:


> The Bible!!!
> 
> Since theres no religion section... Which Im totally fine with by the way.... A world without religion, is what I would call, a big step in the right direction.... Ill just leave this here.
> 
> ...





george990 said:


> The Bible!!!
> 
> Since theres no religion section... Which Im totally fine with by the way.... A world without religion, is what I would call, a big step in the right direction.... Ill just leave this here.
> 
> ...


 And suddenly we turn into what we thinks whatever was said... .


roughdraft said:


> i hear you on this - we agree there is some valuable content in the literature, in the stories - but when people act as if things can be solved through prayer or simply petition for everyone to 'pray', yeah it is pretty fuckin ridiculous because it's hard to believe it *does* anything and even more importantly- does hardly anyone actually do it?
> 
> you know something there was a tornado in Oklahoma, real serious one a whole town all but got put in a bodybag and - i hate to bring this up especially here - but i read one quick news article on it and they got the celebrity twitter shit happening...'prayers for the citizens of this town' and later some guy. not as much a celebrity but still mainstream famous says some shit like 'just want to thank @beyonce and At fuckin so and so for their prayers. All i could send to <town people suffering extra hard> was money' And i thought Talk that shit bro....enough said....
> 
> ...


Action to become the words maybe...i dont know but and i still dont know


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## Dameon (Feb 10, 2019)

jimmyf said:


> I’m just gonna say if you read the Bible from front to back, then your opinion would change. Doesn’t mean you’ll agree with Christianity, but the Bible predicts a lot of the negative stuff going on in our society today. Some is directly stated, some is through symbolism.
> 
> We’re all entitled to our own opinions and beliefs, but at least educate yourself before trying to tear apart someone else’s... just sayin...


I've read the bible from front to back many, many times. Most of the "history" in the bible either isn't corroborated by other historical records, or directly contradicts other historical records. As far as the new testament goes, they don't even know who wrote most of the books of the New Testament, except that the earliest of them dates to 100 years after the death of Jesus, and they were written in Greek, a language none of the apostles would have been familiar with (even if they happened to be literate, which they probably weren't). The names of the authors, and the belief that they come from the apostles, is purely "tradition". All of the "miracles" Jesus performed mirror other standard miracles performed by other religious practitioners. For example, turning water to wine was standard for priests of Bacchus. Several of the books of the New Testament directly contradict each other. For example, Matthew says that Judas hanged himself after the death of Jesus, but Paul and Mark make it clear that he was supposedly there when Jesus appeared after his resurrection. Acts says Judas buys a field and then falls in a hole and his entrails explode out. That's one of MANY contradictions.

As far as the prophesies in the bible go, those prophesies are nice and vague, and people have thought that they applied to their generation pretty much since the birth of Christianity. If the bible was actually the holy words of an omniscient god, there's no reason he shouldn't be able to just say "world war 3 will start on April 3rd, 2023", except that specifics don't leave any room to claim you just didn't interpret the prophecy right.


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## Joe Btfsplk (Feb 10, 2019)

George Carlin said of religion, "I don't believe in ghosts."

I agree.


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## roughdraft (Feb 10, 2019)

Joe Btfsplk said:


> George Carlin said of religion, "I don't believe in ghosts."
> 
> I agree.



that's pretty fair.

What if you saw what was a solid descriptipn of a ghost, though? would it just make you question things a bit?


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## jimmyf (Feb 10, 2019)

Dameon said:


> I've read the bible from front to back many, many times. Most of the "history" in the bible either isn't corroborated by other historical records, or directly contradicts other historical records. As far as the new testament goes, they don't even know who wrote most of the books of the New Testament, except that the earliest of them dates to 100 years after the death of Jesus, and they were written in Greek, a language none of the apostles would have been familiar with (even if they happened to be literate, which they probably weren't). The names of the authors, and the belief that they come from the apostles, is purely "tradition". All of the "miracles" Jesus performed mirror other standard miracles performed by other religious practitioners. For example, turning water to wine was standard for priests of Bacchus. Several of the books of the New Testament directly contradict each other. For example, Matthew says that Judas hanged himself after the death of Jesus, but Paul and Mark make it clear that he was supposedly there when Jesus appeared after his resurrection. Acts says Judas buys a field and then falls in a hole and his entrails explode out. That's one of MANY contradictions.
> 
> As far as the prophesies in the bible go, those prophesies are nice and vague, and people have thought that they applied to their generation pretty much since the birth of Christianity. If the bible was actually the holy words of an omniscient god, there's no reason he shouldn't be able to just say "world war 3 will start on April 3rd, 2023", except that specifics don't leave any room to claim you just didn't interpret the prophecy right.



Well yeah, that’s why I don’t agree with Christianity. Most of the historical records wouldn’t line up with the Bible, because contrary to what Sunday school taught me, the people of the Old Testament were a completely different group than the New Testament.

The Old Testament was about the Israelites, and the Jews a very small remnant(2 tribes, 10 are lost) of the Israelites. The Assyrian invasion around 500 BC whiped out the 10 lost tribes. The Babylonian invasion killed most of the Jews.

Then King Cyrus of Persia attacked and freed the Jews, and that lines up with the history of the Greeks, because they had an alliance. However, Greeks are barely mentioned in the Old Testament aside from that.

Then the New Testament picks up with the Romans ruling over the Jews. Greeks and Romans were the ones to start Christianity. I’m with you that Christianity was pretty much all lies.

Churches ask for 10%, but the reason the Bible says donate 10% is because the church used to be the government which is why Jews hates tax collectors. They were being taxed twice. Like I’m with you dude, but at the same time, I won’t discredit an entire book, because of the interpretation others have put on it.


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## Dameon (Feb 10, 2019)

jimmyf said:


> Like I’m with you dude, but at the same time, I won’t discredit an entire book, because of the interpretation others have put on it.


If somebody constantly tells you lies, eventually you stop listening to them, because you can't separate the truth from the fiction. This is why the bible is considered religious literature, not history. There's so many lies and inaccuracies that it's impossible to tell what in it is real. It's not an "interpretation", it just doesn't make any sense to take anything in a primarily fictional book as reality. Just because Harry Potter features real places doesn't mean that Hogwarts is real.


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## Joe Btfsplk (Feb 10, 2019)

roughdraft typed:

"What if you saw what was a solid descriptipn of a ghost, though? would it just make you question things a bit?"

I have no idea. That has never happened, I doubt if it ever will. Fantasy is pretend. Reality is ruder.

jimmyf mentioned tithing, giving 10% of what you earn to the church weekly. That is like the Mafia going around to local stores and saying what a nice place the business was and how terrible if it burned down.

Give weekly to the church and be safe; allay the wrath of god.


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## roughdraft (Feb 10, 2019)

Joe Btfsplk said:


> roughdraft typed:
> 
> "What if you saw what was a solid descriptipn of a ghost, though? would it just make you question things a bit?"
> 
> I have no idea. That has never happened, I doubt if it ever will. Fantasy is pretend. Reality is ruder.



so what is your personal take on people who say they've seen ghosts, and it made them question...whats the best way to say....the limits of their perception on reality? that, what they see is not fantasy?

I've never really read a strong scientific explanation on hallucinations of any sort but some things I have seen, especially when i was a child, resembled ghosts and other "entities" and appeared a lot more than a 'trick of the light' or what have you

tell me what ya really think and don't hold back


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 10, 2019)

I have seen heard tasted smelt and felt ghost... I can't explain it. But many times throughout my life I have been exposed to what I feel to be what is called a ghost. 
To define a ghost tho...? So difficult. Is it a meer Flux in time space quantum mechanics allowing energy through? Static energy from a time past? Witch is hard to believe if you believe in energy and quantum physics... I am also surprised this thread hasn't become more philisophical...


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 10, 2019)

UsernameTaken said:


> Sucks you never learned how to spell DELUSIONAL correctly


Sucks you can't see past a spelling error.


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 10, 2019)

UsernameTaken said:


> Sucks you never learned how to spell DELUSIONAL correctly


Also sucks that the only thing you have to say is pointing out the faults of others... 
Nothing with any substance thought or even any fucking relavenc to the conversation. Maybe try to adult a little, go back and read the agreement to stp maybe I fucking hate this personal demeaning off topic bs. Your comment is useless af man. Get a life and troll someplace els.


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## roughdraft (Feb 10, 2019)

feel ya @BirdDaddy man half of this thread is arguing about history which...call me a wingnut but impossible to prove....and hissyfits over ego stuff... the universe and reality holds a lot of mystery.... let's enjoy discussing it and not be forum oogles, eh?

fuck all this 2018 - 2019 / dillusional - delusional ass bullshit

So the two of us have seen and felt ghosts and surely we are not alone 

is there a veritable way to learn more about these critters ?


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## roughdraft (Feb 10, 2019)

or we can all agree it'd be fine to just pray for them :-D


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## Deleted member 22934 (Feb 10, 2019)

If theres two thing I'll never be good at, its remembering dates, and knowing how to spell words. So if I never get better at those two things, that would be alright by me. Those are two of the least most important things in life.


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## Dameon (Feb 10, 2019)

roughdraft said:


> feel ya @BirdDaddy man half of this thread is arguing about history which...call me a wingnut but impossible to prove....and hissyfits over ego stuff... the universe and reality holds a lot of mystery.... let's enjoy discussing it and not be forum oogles, eh?
> 
> fuck all this 2018 - 2019 / dillusional - delusional ass bullshit
> 
> ...


Yeah, fuck all that history stuff, it's impossible to prove except with corroboration, anthropology, and archaeology. Let's talk about _ghosts._ Makes sense. On topic because...I guess if there's ghosts, the bible is true? I'm not seeing the connection.


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## roughdraft (Feb 10, 2019)

Dameon said:


> Yeah, fuck all that history stuff, it's impossible to prove except with corroboration, anthropology, and archaeology. Let's talk about _ghosts._ Makes sense. On topic because...I guess if there's ghosts, the bible is true? I'm not seeing the connection.



yeah i know my personal ideas about history are very, very out there on the fringe and are quite unpopular. that's all fine and good, my opinions can maybe someday change, and until then I'm not forcing anyone to take them as valid. 

and I guess I/we can take the ghost stuff to another thread. I think it came up from the debate about...what is legitimate in the Bible? and what is God and blah blah something something where is the line between reality and fantasy? with ghosts being an example and. to me. something in the grey area, since i have seen them. not everyone has seen them and of course everyone has opinions on what I really saw


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 10, 2019)

Dameon said:


> Yeah, fuck all that history stuff, it's impossible to prove except with corroboration, anthropology, and archaeology. Let's talk about _ghosts._ Makes sense. On topic because...I guess if there's ghosts, the bible is true? I'm not seeing the connection.


 I believe it was more of a comparison/ analogy thing than a stated fact. But idk I'm here with open minde. You should try it. 
It's definitely a perception thing. As is most of this thread. And life...And perception being a relavenc issue upon belief systems built by life experiences... going into a ghost topic would surly change the topic of this thread. so I agree and will not peruse it here. But to go around demeaning ppl with a different point of view and pick apart there words so carful sounds like your here for a different reason. Try listining take some leave some, don't allow it to make you feel angry or bitter bro. Just let it be man. If you think it's off topic say so. Don't get agro.


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## Dameon (Feb 10, 2019)

BirdDaddy said:


> If you think it's off topic say so.


I did.


> Don't get agro.


I didn't.


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## roughdraft (Feb 10, 2019)

i always like reading from @Dameon he seems like a guy who really knows shit. but i do gotta ask. do you feel passionate about history? do you feel like you're totally certain of any of it's accuracy based on what you said....archaeology, anthropology....? you trust all these corroborators ?


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 10, 2019)

Dameon said:


> I did.
> 
> I didn't.


See how this perception thing goes.


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 10, 2019)

I also agree with @roughdraft, @Dameon has an opinion iv found to be knowledgeable, informed and thought through. I agree with both sides of the history shit and allot of the other crap on this post but let's get real. It's all a matter of opinion and nobody is wrong so to say.


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## Matt Derrick (Feb 10, 2019)

not that anyone asked, but my .02 is that all religions are both wrong and right, and there is no one single answer to existence. in my opinion we're all one collective consciousness experiencing itself subjectively and nothing really matters except the journey itself.



so when reading over this, and getting upset at other people's views, or opinions of _your _views, just take a moment, breathe, and remember.

it's just a ride.


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## Dameon (Feb 11, 2019)

roughdraft said:


> i always like reading from @Dameon he seems like a guy who really knows shit. but i do gotta ask. do you feel passionate about history? do you feel like you're totally certain of any of it's accuracy based on what you said....archaeology, anthropology....? you trust all these corroborators ?


I don't think that recorded history is 100% accurate and reliable, but I do believe that much of recorded history can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, which is more provable than ghosts, which was my original point.


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## roughdraft (Feb 11, 2019)

Dameon said:


> I don't think that recorded history is 100% accurate and reliable, but I do believe that much of recorded history can be proven beyond a reasonable doubt, which is more provable than ghosts, which was my original point.



the best i can do to convey my point is this -> i have not witnessed history, but i have witnessed what was either a ghost or looked exactly like one. i have reason to believe it was a ghost. i can't prove that it was a ghost but I (like to) think even things that cannot be proven can be true or real. lmao....


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## roughdraft (Feb 11, 2019)

Matt Derrick said:


> not that anyone asked, but my .02 is that all religions are both wrong and right, and there is no one single answer to existence. in my opinion we're all one collective consciousness experiencing itself subjectively.



well of course everyone should put their two cents in!! the most important part is not pinning down the subjective experience but knowing what needs to be known about it - as you say, the journey - and keeping one's emotions in check is a cornerstone of it, by that I have no doubt. i would say most real and avoidable tragedies whether they happen in an instant or are prolonged happen due to emotional mismanagement...but there i go, easy words to put together - now let's see if i can avoid fucking up my actions extensively today based on that concept. xD


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## Dameon (Feb 11, 2019)

roughdraft said:


> the best i can do to convey my point is this -> i have not witnessed history, but i have witnessed what was either a ghost or looked exactly like one. i have reason to believe it was a ghost. i can't prove that it was a ghost but I (like to) think even things that cannot be proven can be true or real. lmao....


I've never seen the pyramids, but I've seen a little green alien in the middle of a dirt field. By your logic, little green aliens are more real than the pyramids. 'course, the problem is that the little green alien was something I saw while I was tripping on shrooms. Your temporary perceptions as an individual are unreliable; your brain can malfunction and show you things that aren't there or keep you from seeing things that are. It's easy for us humans to jump to the conclusion we want based on unreliable perceptions, when what we need to do is verify those perceptions through consensus and experimentation (some of the same tools historians use).


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## roughdraft (Feb 11, 2019)

Dameon said:


> I've never seen the pyramids, but I've seen a little green alien in the middle of a dirt field. By your logic, little green aliens are more real than the pyramids. 'course, the problem is that the little green alien was something I saw while I was tripping on shrooms. Your temporary perceptions as an individual are unreliable; your brain can malfunction and show you things that aren't there or keep you from seeing things that are. It's easy for us humans to jump to the conclusion we want based on unreliable perceptions, when what we need to do is verify those perceptions through consensus and experimentation (some of the same tools historians use).



right, excellent. But is is easier to believe that the pyramids are there, same as the Eiffel Tower, without MY own eyes seeing it. rather than a complex series of events. Objective vs subjective right? I have seen enough photos of people standing in front of the Eiffel Tower, not easy to fabricate....in my opinion, history is much easier to fabricate, or really, any story. so that is not my logic.

As for the example of a little green alien while on mushrooms - my whole point in even bringing up ghosts is that I have ONLY seen them while stone cold sober - and they are not even the most controversial thing I have actually witnessed, again, sober as a rock. including when I was a mere child. I would personally never speak on things I had seen under the influence of hallucinogens in a discussion on {what is real} because that is just too easy to shoot down. How can we decide the brain is malfunctioning if I see something that resembles a ghost without ANY premonition of say....,wanting, to see one? or the presence of documented hallucination-promoting substances?


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## RoadFlower33 (Feb 11, 2019)

I think we got off topic. 
As far as religion itself why it exsist how it is used and if it is benifical to the betterment of man is is whare it was going... 
Originally (I think...) that @george990 was just ranting on how fed up with how christians who are too small minded, closed minded , concrete thinking, black and white thinking, full cup mother fuckers going around spewing their opinions, forcing their beliefs culture and publicly pointing out the faults of others and Damning them to a fucking fictional afterlife so well known as hell just bc you don't have faith in a God aka "ghost" a "myth" , legend idfk nor do I care how you call him. Honest? I don't think anybody here does. The point. I don't see any other cults, agencies, or clubs of the like ( The Machine excluded) to be going around spewing all over everyone. It's fucking annoying and I get his point. I'm sure some of the nice LDS ladies I talk to about LSD have thought about what I said. Most won't give it a second thought bc their cup is full already... What I have always liked about STP is for the most part ppl on here don't think there cup is full. In fact I believe most of us here are looking for understanding, knowledg and a different point of view than the lies fed to us by mainstream media, culture, schools... Fucking History Books!!! For God sakes.... all I'm saying is let's stop quibbling over words, empty our cups a little and we could have a good conversation here again. 

I personally agree with @Matt Derrick


Matt Derrick said:


> not that anyone asked, but my .02 is that all religions are both wrong and right, and there is no one single answer to existence. in my opinion we're all one collective consciousness experiencing itself subjectively and nothing really matters except the journey itself.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I get pretty deep in this kinda philosophy in my own way all the time. I love hearing other praspectivs, ideas and experiences bc as far as I am concerned all of our emotions, praspectivs, opinions and experiences are just as valid as my reality is to myself and therfore I can not condone anybody anyplace for anything they believe bc I can only hope to be able to relate enough to understand a hint of their respective lives. As is my struggle every day. 
Have a nice day, I'm done here.


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## roughdraft (Feb 11, 2019)

BirdDaddy said:


> I love hearing other[s'] praspectivs, ideas and experiences bc [.....] I can only hope to be able to relate enough to understand a hint of their respective lives.



i feel that this is the best reason to debate, i hate when people want to dominate or prove themselves a "right" vs a "wrong" party. i see pushing the envelope in any debate as a way to, hopefully. procure a more deep understanding of others. and the more different the two perspectives, the more to be gained cheers man


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## Deleted member 20683 (Mar 15, 2019)

Wow did this thread blow up! I was shy to check back in...I want to point out that there are kind of two wildly different subjects in discussion here, 1. The Bible 2. Religion per se. or to bring them together, the Bible as an interpreted text, of which there are many interpretations. I didn’t grow up with religion at all, and I profess respect to those who did along with whatever negative or positive feelings and ideas they have about whatever affects it had on them. But I started learning the Bible (particularly the Hebrew Bible as I am of Jewish background) while over 25 and working on a degree in philosophy and I have a lot to say about it as a work of literature. 

Too much really to fit in one readable post but here’s a start. The Bible as we know it is a mosaic of texts that derive from the oral traditions of one or more tribal societies, that were written down and woven together over about a millennium- so to speak of it as a unified text at all is already to adopt a certain theological discourse about the generation within which its final redaction took place. I find value in e.g. Daniel Quinn’s interpretation of genesis 1-4 regarding the conflict of nomadic gatherer-hunters and early Neolithic agrarians, but then again the era of biblical patriarchs are described as pastoralist (herding) nomads. Some historians like Norman gottwald hypothesize that the Israelites were a tribal confederacy of people who escaped forced labor in the city states of Canaan and the empires of Egypt and Mesopotamia, in short ‘maroons’. While eco-radicals like Derrick Jensen may point to the passages of Torah that proscribe destruction of the canaanites, most historians now see that the Israelites in fact *were* canaanites (or closely connected to them) and understand such passages to have been written centuries later than the era they purport to describe, revolving around that times social political and religious conflicts. History or historianship as we now conceive it did not exist in 1000 bce... Reading the Bible as though it did provides fuel for the ingrained anti-semitism of western civilization, whether in its avowedly fascist or most ‘radical’ variants.


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## Deleted member 20683 (Mar 15, 2019)

Oh and as for religion per se...I was brought up with a very standard western secular scientific perspective that it’s exactly as the title says, a ‘fairy tale’, a factually incorrect narrative. But I see it now more in terms of a way to live. If you have a belief that there’s a more real level of reality than what’s material (as the material needs to come from somewhere, the meta-physical) and you have a point of view that this force behind existence is benevolent then that’s maybe a better thing to believe than in mere metaphysical nihilism, as much as more than to believe there’s a personal deity who cares what you eat, wear etc...it doesn’t rule out, either, the value of ancient texts written by people who considered themselves related to such a power. Yes the Bible is often horrifically patriarchal (also, where are the women/non-binaries in this thread?) but consider the prophets who were basically anti authoritarian performance artists


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## Dameon (Mar 16, 2019)

oak moth said:


> Yes the Bible is often horrifically patriarchal (also, where are the women/non-binaries in this thread?) but consider the prophets who were basically anti authoritarian performance artists


How can you be "anti authoritarian" while serving the supreme authority of a god? We're talking about the same god who told dude to sacrifice his son and expected that he'd do it, that commands complete and total obedience. The same god that turned Lot's wife into a fucking _pillar of salt_ for disobeying him and looking back while he destroyed multiple cities for, you know, disobeying him. And they weren't "performance artists", they were mentally disturbed religious zealots. People who believed a giant magic sky man was telling them the future. Before psychology, schizophrenics were prophets. Why do you think the entire book of Revelations sounds like the ramblings of a crazy dude on the bus?

The bible is beyond horrifically patriarchal. It's twisted and messed up. It tells people to kill for a whole range of minor offenses, encourages genocide, and portrays a god who will strike down basically anybody for any transgression any time, or entire cities of people, or will command his people to kill an entire city of people; men, women, and children. Because being all powerful, he needs to have some people just brutally slaughter children for him.


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## Deleted member 24782 (Mar 16, 2019)

Most inspirational song of my youth back when I was a born-again Christian:

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Our God is an awesome God he reigns
From heaven above with wisdom, power and love
Our God is an awesome God

Yes, this is the ACTUAL song, and this how many times you have to sing the chorus. At least 16 times.


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## RoadFlower33 (Mar 16, 2019)

@Brodiesel710 what's your point?


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## Deleted member 24782 (Mar 16, 2019)

BirdDaddy said:


> @Brodiesel710 what's your point?



Point was, I was recounting how absurd it was to have to sing this shit during the "praise and worship" services I had to attend as a teenager. The "inspirational" part was sarcasm.


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## roughdraft (Mar 16, 2019)

Brodiesel710 said:


> Most inspirational song of my youth back when I was a born-again Christian:
> 
> Our God na na na na short edit
> 
> Yes, this is the ACTUAL song, and this how many times you have to sing the chorus. At least 16 times.



not kidding, i think i heard that song on the radio going through Roseburg one time. it was inspiring after the first couple repeats, then i went thru about every uncomfortable emotion realizing how bad of a mantra it is


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## RoadFlower33 (Mar 16, 2019)

Ok, I get it, I was once also born again and yeah its obsurd programming for sure. My experience as a born again really opened me up to the insane ideals of mind control and government


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## roughdraft (Mar 16, 2019)

i briefly considered myself a born-again Christian after having good chat with a couple 'devout' Christians one winter living in the northwest. basically what struck me was that every spirit exists and it could be that Christ is effectively the big fish in a small pond (that being the universe) then I realized i was just smoking way way too much fucking hash


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## Dameon (Mar 16, 2019)

Those songs are straight up brainwashing, that's why the repetition. So it gets driven into your brain, and stays there for good. They're also nearly always sung right before collection, because people will give more after being part of a crowd singing together. It's a powerful experience, and basically puts you into a state where you're very suggestible, right before the pastor starts drilling some Jesus into your head.

Churches use the exact same tactics as cults. They draw you in by telling you you're an evil sinner, but dangling the idea that if you join them, you'll no longer be a bad person. Once you join, you're showered with love, and they all invite you to social outings to the point where you basically only have Christian friends. If you leave the church, you're denounced and called a "backslider", and suddenly you won't have any friends and won't get invited to anything. When you run into your former friends in public, they'll tell you that you can be restored to grace and have everything like it was if you just go back to serving Jesus.

Brainwashing is a real tool that religions use pretty much openly without it being considered an issue just because most people are religious. Religions have literally evolved (google memetics) to be the best they can at basically taking over your brain and making you a carrier of that religion. It's not coincidence that Catholicism prohibits birth control, or Mormonism encourages people to have as many children as they can. A great essay on this is Viruses of the Mind , by Richard Dawkins.


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## Coywolf (Mar 16, 2019)

roughdraft said:


> not kidding, i think i heard that song on the radio going through Roseburg one time. it was inspiring after the first couple repeats, then i went thru about every uncomfortable emotion realizing how bad of a mantra it is



That doesnt surprise me, coming from Roseburg....

And ya, those songs were developed by the Church as a form of mind control. Organized religion is just a way to control the populous, period. I believe that faith has very little to do with any church organizations. Look at the LDS hierarchy. I mean, Jesus (literally), those people are obviously using the church as a form of control. They are the only ones who can "hear the word of God"? You can literally buy your way into the Quorum of Twelve.


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## Deleted member 24782 (Mar 16, 2019)

Dameon said:


> .......making you a carrier of that religion. It's not coincidence that Catholicism prohibits birth control, or Mormonism encourages people to have as many children as they can. A great essay on this is Viruses of the Mind , by Richard Dawkins.



So true! Very insightful, thank you.


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## RoadFlower33 (Mar 17, 2019)

Good talk, good talk.


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## MFB (Mar 19, 2019)

Coywolf said:


> That doesnt surprise me, coming from Roseburg....
> 
> And ya, those songs were developed by the Church as a form of mind control. Organized religion is just a way to control the populous, period. I believe that faith has very little to do with any church organizations. Look at the LDS hierarchy. I mean, Jesus (literally), those people are obviously using the church as a form of control. They are the only ones who can "hear the word of God"? You can literally buy your way into the Quorum of Twelve.



Under the Banner of Heaven, John Krakauer, such a good book about the LDS. Insane, fact is way stranger than fiction shit.


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## Deleted member 24782 (Mar 19, 2019)

MFB said:


> Under the Banner of Heaven, John Krakauer, such a good book about the LDS. Insane, fact is way stranger than fiction shit.



I'm familiar with John Krakauer, I will look into this book. Thanks.


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## Coywolf (Mar 19, 2019)

MFB said:


> Under the Banner of Heaven, John Krakauer, such a good book about the LDS. Insane, fact is way stranger than fiction shit.



That book is great. Almost better than Inti The Wild. It gives you a good look into the religion, and the extremist sects that spurred off of it.


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## MFB (Mar 21, 2019)

Coywolf said:


> That book is great. Almost better than Inti The Wild. It gives you a good look into the religion, and the extremist sects that spurred off of it.


All his stuff is REALLY good. A great compact writer and a great research jounalist. 
He wrote a good book on the rape scandals in Missoula and the 96 Everest disaster, plus a lot of his own climbing stuff. Sharp dood. 
Highly recommend reading anything he has written.


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## Shaggy Rogers (Aug 17, 2019)

george990 said:


> If people have nothing better to do than fantasize about imaginary creatures, then good for them... But in real life, to talk and act like its a real thing, is straight up dillusional... Have they done any research? Do they have any idea whats going on in this world?
> 
> I like to imagine and fantasize about being 6'2" muscular, with a hot blonde girlfriend and a furrari.... Does that make it real? NO! Im short, I dont have a six pack and Ill never have enough money to buy a sports car or ride a hot blonde.... So I wouldnt go around talking about it, like its reality in life...


Ive actually said something way too close to this recently. Is gross to hear it on the news for EVERY story. Like imagine if one day everyone just realized that science and logic is right. I cant even imagine how fucking amazing it would be.


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