# LETS TALK ABOUT RAPE!



## PinkLore

Okay, so I got a long car ride and this shit has been on mind and it seems to be a fairly common subject, so I'm hoping this is a safe place to talk about it.
Ive been raped twice since I lost my van, and once when I still had it.

I refuse to look at myself to blame for these things happening. I dont know if I'm in the wrong place at the wrong time, or whatever the fuck.
I dont want to go into details about all the instances...but part of me is hoping other people experienced this and part of me hopes maybe its just my own misfortune.
I'm still trucking. But the last time it happened, it made me want to quit being on the road all together.

I dont want tips or precautions. I beat the shit out of the last kid who touched me. But its not just straight rape. Its all of the touching and inquiries. I'm fucking sick of it.

I'm still trucking! Still on the road! And I try to analyse every incident to keep it from ever happening. But to be totally honest you guys....sometimes I feel like saying fuck it.
.

Can we just have a venting sesh here? Can this forum be a safe place to confide these feelings?
Like I said, spare me the tips. Its insulting. Fuck your bear mace and knifes. I dont need a lesson. I just want to feel like I'm not alone.


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## Deleted member 125

yer deffinetly not alone. its not something that ive had alot of first hand experience with but i know its not as uncommon as alot of people would like to think it is. its a huge problem even in this small subculture. stay strong yo!

and of course stp is somewhere where you can freely talk about this kind of thing.


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## PinkLore

SlankyLanky said:


> yer deffinetly not alone. its not something that ive had alot of first hand experience with but i know its not as uncommon as alot of people would like to think it is. its a huge problem even in this small subculture. stay strong yo!
> 
> and of course stp is somewhere where you can freely talk about this kind of thing.


⭐thanks man


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## EphemeralStick

My first sexual experience was when I was 15, I was raped by a guy in his mid twenties. After that I started going to more and more parties with older men where I'd get blackout drunk and wake up to someone inside me, this happened quite a bit.

I've been abducted for three days by a guy who slipped me meth and he kept me so spun out I couldn't get away from him until finally he ran out of drugs and I sobered up enough to get away.
I've been a victim of rape and sexual assault time and time again. I wish I could say that time of my life is over but even just last year in Austin a guy drugged me with some sort of opioid.

Everytime it happens it feels like a piece of myself gets taken from me. Again and again. It leaves a hollowness inside you that never really goes away.

I went to therapy, it helped tremendously but still that hole remains. I'm sorry that you too feel that emptiness. I wouldn't wish it on my worst of enemies.

You are not alone.


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## junkpolecat99

Everybody stay safe!!!!!


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## Deleted member 16034

I got drugged and raped at a party when I was 15, this guy tried driving me into the middle of a forest but I told him I had GPS on my cell phone (This was in the days that GPS on cell phones was super new and nobody was totally sure how they worked) so he stopped at some mini mart in the boonies and got a thirty rack of natty ice or some shit, said that store was the only place he knew that stocked them, then he turned around and took me to where I told him I lived. I walked two miles back home to find that my mom had locked me out of the house because she thought that I had just run away from home. 

I was in a long-time off and on relationship with a well-ish known traveler (He's been mentioned on one of these forums, but I won't say which), he was super abusive. Convinced me that he had murdered seven people, told me that I was next. Told me he could kill me, hide my body, and be on a train out of town before anyone even knew I was missing. He also thought "No" meant "Try harder." A few women have come forward about his rape-y behaviour.

The lead singer of a folk punk band that swears they aren't a folk punk band sexually assaulted me in Seattle, the girl he was supposed to go off with actually lives in the same town as me now and every time I run into her I wonder what she knows, if anything at all. 


Best way to avoid being sexually assaulted as a woman on the road, statistically speaking, is by forming a crew of anyone that isn't a straight man (Sorry straight men, but for real though). Grrl gangs are fucking awesome.


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## RoadFlower33

Rape. Tough subject. I personally don't like the topic. It' not anybodys fault but the person doing the raping. Honestly i would do my best to murder a motherfucker. Currently looking for one right now. I'm just not okay with it.


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## junkpolecat99

"Best way to avoid being sexually assaulted as a woman on the road, statistically speaking, is by forming a crew of anyone that isn't a straight man (Sorry straight men, but for real though). Grrl gangs are fucking awesome."


a gWEEDO frienz crew?


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## Deleted member 16034

junkpolecat99 said:


> "Best way to avoid being sexually assaulted as a woman on the road, statistically speaking, is by forming a crew of anyone that isn't a straight man (Sorry straight men, but for real though). Grrl gangs are fucking awesome."
> 
> 
> a gWEEDO frienz crew?



@SlankyLanky Told ya he was a tweaker.


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## BelleBottoms

I lucked out several times. Five near-instances I can think of without thinking too hard. Back then when I was 20 and on the road, I was clean, sober, and quite confident, which I think helped with being able to talk myself out of corners I got backed into. But, seriously, I think luck had a lot to do with it. So many old nasty perverts... revolting fucksticks get that twinkle in their eye like they just found something shiney... and you better believe that even an encounter that doesn't end in rape with these pieces of shit makes you want to dry-heave that sour pit out of your stomach for the next week...


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## PinkLore

BelleBottoms said:


> revolting fucksticks get that twinkle in their eye like they just found something shiney... and you better believe that even an encounter that doesn't end in rape with these pieces of shit makes you want to dry-heave that sour pit out of your stomach for the next week...



Wow well said.


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## freegander

i am glad this thread (so far) has been a safe space. <3 



BelleBottoms said:


> So many old nasty perverts... revolting fucksticks get that twinkle in their eye like they just found something shiney... and you better believe that even an encounter that doesn't end in rape with these pieces of shit makes you want to dry-heave that sour pit out of your stomach for the next week...


i haven't spent any time traveling solo in the states, primarily because of this shit. traveling can be exhausting enough without the constant reminder that i am a woman. sometimes i'd just like to forget.


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## Matt Derrick

although we can't prevent every idiot out there from posting something stupid in this thread (as evidenced by @junkpolecat99's posts) know that everyone here on the StP staff is doing our best to make not just this thread a safe space, but StP as a whole a place where everyone can come together and talk about these topics without having to deal with stupidity or harassment. we definitely have your back; if there's ever an issue with any member (even myself/staff members) please don't hesitate to bring it up and we'll do our best to make the situation better.

that said, i'm just going to take a step back and try to learn from the experiences being shared here.


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## WieselFlink

Weird how many people here, besides me, had the exact same experience. Beeing 15 and getting drugged. You know the rest.


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## croc

EphemeralStick said:


> Everytime it happens it feels like a piece of myself gets taken from me. Again and again. It leaves a hollowness inside you that never really goes away.
> .



Exactly. There's always a chance to heal but (in my experience at least) the scars ain't goin nowhere. And I'll never feel the same about my body. Tbh I kinda try to separate myself from my body now. Thinking of it as someone else that I want to nurture and heal helps. Maybe that's not so healthy but it works for me. 

It's so easy to fall into blaming ourselves, especially when society always responds with what we should be doing about getting raped. 

I didn't consider what happened to me when I was 16/17 (and they were mid 20s) assault because "I chose to hang out with them" and "I should have known to keep my guard up". Years later I realized the age difference alone was a pretty good indicator that it was wrong. Learning that just because I only said no and didn't physically fight back doesn't mean I consented. 

I let myself be used time and time again after that because I was afraid that if I said no and they didn't listen that I'd have to live with being raped again. I couldn't have "normal" sex for most of my life after that bc my brain was so scrambled. It's like it had to be violent Maybe that was my brain's way of coping, adjusting to "enjoy" being forced or uncomfortable or hit. 

Mostly it all makes me so angry. Like how could anyone think they get to use my body? How could anyone respond to this situation by not wanting to brutally murder someone who would rape? Why does no one teach teenagers about the depth and details of true consent? There needs to be education so young people (or anyone) never feel like they were responsible for not saying no loudly enough or persistently enough. 

You're not alone with this ever, at all. We're here for you. And thank you for starting this thread. It's nice to feel connected to yall and understood.

If anyone ever wants to message me to vent or get help, my inbox is open.
<3


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## visionquest3311

I just posted about this in another thread and a person didnt agree with me. I will repost here.

I have had near rape encounters many times with strangers but luckily was somewhat sober and somehow got out of it.

Though I have been raped twice by male friends.

This is the previous post, I responded to her response that I was acting like I was responsible since I said " I should have known better". Which sorry for me and myself I should have, though I have no fault in it...


Hi I see where you are coming from but I don't feel that way. I have little emotions connected to the rape, at the time I was sickened by it but then let it go.

I am a female who knows how male sexuality works. In an ideal world yes obviously he should have never tried to take advantage of me but we don't live in an ideal world. Cis men and women have different sexualities and when base males who just react from their sexual urges see an attractive female they get horny and many want to hump. If I am around atypical males as a woman I definitely make sure I don't get wasted around them and put myself in a situation where I could be raped. It is the way some men operate that as a woman equal to them in their eyes if I am drunk or very drunk you take responsibility for yourself and make plans accordingly.

Obviously people who purposely get someone drunk to have sex with them or till they pass out then rape them should be prosecuted. But being aware of alcohol and males in the first place would avoid the situation. We definitely need more awareness.

The guy that raped me in his mind it was a sex act. I would never prosecute him because he really believed that and well he's an idiot. He really had no clue. Though I am sure you will see that as an excuse for my predator but he is an equal to me. Another sad misinformed human being with a poor upbringing. I feel compassion for him.


I want to add that my rapes were not violent and drugged. They were more in the view of a sex act to the uneducated males they happened with but for me it was rape. We drank together I told one to stop kissing me but was most likely half assed drunkenly kissing him but told him no I dont want to have sex with him. In the morning I wake up to him humping me like a dog.

I would still go to bars by myself and hang out but am now more aware that men wanna fuck and I just want to hang out with other human beings.

I still travel the world by myself but again am weary. I have been followed and grabbed. So far again I've been lucky if thats even the correct word for it ....

I dont hitchhike anymore because I have too many shitty encounters. Even traveling as a group of females unless you have some females who are juiced I wouldnt do it. Too many sad fucked up males who werent breast fed enough or didnt get enough love from their mamas that want to take out their deep seated resentment on a female.


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## Prophetess333

Victims are not responsible or at fault. No one asks to be raped. I've a friend who was raped twice; once when 13 years old then later when she was on a hospital mental ward. 
No means no, people need to learn to control themselves and respect that.
Males, females, anyone could be a victim houseless or not. 
There are domestic violence centers around the states that offer free counseling and stuff.


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## Pokebert

I’m going to keep my head up and stay sober minded on the road, especially with strangers and other vagabonds. Alcohol is fun, but I don’t want to get fucked up with strangers, and I will have pepper spray on me in the event that my pre-preparedness doesn’t work (though I don’t anticipate ever having to use it).

It’s a very shitty reality, but avoiding sexual assault means to always be keen and aware of your surroundings and the people you are with. Same goes with any form of assault, really.


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## Oddy

You're not alone, when I was 16 I was hanging out with a group of guys in their 20s, my female friend left me at a party and one guy said I could stay at his house. This was the first time I had ever been properly drunk, the vomiting, incapable of walking kind of drunk and he proceeded get on top of and tell me that it wasn't cool that I was a virgin and I should just do it with him, well, you all know the rest. Since then I've never let myself get too intoxicated around people I don't know very well, which sucks and I resent having to mediate my own behaviour out of fear. It's kept me safe on my travels but I feel your anger.


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## Kymin Kaos

Hearing all these stories reminds me that we are courageous to talk about this and keep traveling and surviving. I got sexaully assaulted a few times and I can say it is never your fault and you are not alone in having this happen to you. I am sorry that it happened to you and all of us. i think if we talk about it we can support each other and learn from all of our experiences. It is the fault of sexist men who don't understand consent and want to dominate women. They should be educated or ostracized from our community. Or at the very least be called out publicly to warn other women about their predatory behavior. Stand strong women and solidarity between us. No one is at fault.


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## Phuen

How is this thread a safe space for men who were harassed and assaulted, with vile crap like "It is the fault of sexist men" just above, getting liked by Matt Derrick the admin???

I'm a man now, but when I was a boy of 19 traveling the US and UK, I've had my near drugged-and-raped incidents. It turned verbally violent once and luckily nothing further. I consider myself LUCKY to have evaded it, by sheer avoidance of alcohol and keeping an open and brave mouth on me - asking questions.

Shame on Matt Derrick for supporting sexism and hate here!

The fault is with both men and women, together with intoxication being socially accepted without precautions.


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## Older Than Dirt

Women drugged and raped you, Phuen? Bullshit.

Men and boys who have been sexually harassed or assaulted have had that done to them by.... men.


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## Matt Derrick

Phuen said:


> Shame on Matt Derrick for supporting sexism and hate here!



whoa boy, one of these people. joy.

i think you're a bit confused, since their statement was:



Kymin Kaos said:


> It is the fault of sexist men who don't understand consent and want to dominate women. They should be educated or ostracized from our community.



this person didn't say 'all men are sexist' etc... they said there are sexist men. so unless you're a sexist man, i don't think that statement applies to you.


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## Phuen

WTF I can't believe I'm getting mocked for this.

The fault is with *rapists*. Men and women. Not just "sexist men."

I sincerely hope another admin notices this and a discussion is raised, because mocking men who were assaulted is *unacceptable*.


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## Matt Derrick

Holy crap dude. No one is disagreeing with the fact that rape happens to not just women, and we're not arguing that it's just sexist men. Also, no one is mocking you, so please stop derailing this thread.


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## Redfoxes

BelleBottoms said:


> revolting fucksticks get that twinkle in their eye like they just found something shiney... and you better believe that even an encounter that doesn't end in rape with these pieces of shit makes you want to dry-heave that sour pit out of your stomach for the next week...



Oh man. So much this. I lived out of my car for 3 months a short while back, and I spent a night parked on a property in the country, and had a middle aged man tell me I was a pretty young girl and such. This man knew where I was parked but I didn't have anywhere else to go that night. Not much sleep was had. I do have a tent which I set up a short ways from my car as a decoy in case he did turn up maybe I'd see him go for the tent first meanwhile I could floor it out of there. 

Made me feel that good ole sick to the stomach. I have been assaulted before but it wasn't during a time that I was traveling, but back before I traveled at all and was a clueless 19 yr with a shit bf. 
Also yeah, that hollow feeling, in most cases now I only feel that hollow ache when I have panic attacks, but for the first year or so after it happened it was constant.


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## PotBellyFatGuy

visionquest3311 said:


> I just posted about this in another thread and a person didnt agree with me. I will repost here.
> 
> I have had near rape encounters many times with strangers but luckily was somewhat sober and somehow got out of it.
> 
> Though I have been raped twice by male friends.
> 
> This is the previous post, I responded to her response that I was acting like I was responsible since I said " I should have known better". Which sorry for me and myself I should have, though I have no fault in it...
> 
> 
> Hi I see where you are coming from but I don't feel that way. I have little emotions connected to the rape, at the time I was sickened by it but then let it go.
> 
> I am a female who knows how male sexuality works. In an ideal world yes obviously he should have never tried to take advantage of me but we don't live in an ideal world. Cis men and women have different sexualities and when base males who just react from their sexual urges see an attractive female they get horny and many want to hump. If I am around atypical males as a woman I definitely make sure I don't get wasted around them and put myself in a situation where I could be raped. It is the way some men operate that as a woman equal to them in their eyes if I am drunk or very drunk you take responsibility for yourself and make plans accordingly.
> 
> Obviously people who purposely get someone drunk to have sex with them or till they pass out then rape them should be prosecuted. But being aware of alcohol and males in the first place would avoid the situation. We definitely need more awareness.
> 
> The guy that raped me in his mind it was a sex act. I would never prosecute him because he really believed that and well he's an idiot. He really had no clue. Though I am sure you will see that as an excuse for my predator but he is an equal to me. Another sad misinformed human being with a poor upbringing. I feel compassion for him.
> 
> 
> I want to add that my rapes were not violent and drugged. They were more in the view of a sex act to the uneducated males they happened with but for me it was rape. We drank together I told one to stop kissing me but was most likely half assed drunkenly kissing him but told him no I dont want to have sex with him. In the morning I wake up to him humping me like a dog.
> 
> I would still go to bars by myself and hang out but am now more aware that men wanna fuck and I just want to hang out with other human beings.
> 
> I still travel the world by myself but again am weary. I have been followed and grabbed. So far again I've been lucky if thats even the correct word for it ....
> 
> I dont hitchhike anymore because I have too many shitty encounters. Even traveling as a group of females unless you have some females who are juiced I wouldnt do it. Too many sad fucked up males who werent breast fed enough or didnt get enough love from their mamas that want to take out their deep seated resentment on a female.



yes the typical male wants to have sex with women whenever possible. of course that is obvious which is why "the internet is for porn." sex sells bigtime and men are the ones chasing the women. with this basic fact that the world openly knows (and women take advantage of with hypergamy based on their sexual market value), i and my friends have NEVER raped any girl. we have never had a lack of impulse control or have hurt someone, either through breaking local laws or transgressing personal boundaries. we are horny but we are not rapists. if you turn on a guy and go "halfway" like your example story, what is he supposed to do? a vast majority (NOT myself included) would not be able to stop. is that considered rape or did you lead him on and then just expect him to turn off his sexual desire right there and then? he was likely very young too in his 20s. that's a toxic mix for a girl to call "rape." you invite these sexual situations with a man in his sexual prime and then just want it to end as if it is a class lecture or a transaction at a cash register. *you can't have it both ways*. you want to enjoy the sexual experience in the presence of a man - men, whose nature you know very well by default as per your own words - and then turn around and blame him for wanting to desire you. there is no compassion to feel. he did nothing wrong. women are the gatekeepers. if you don't trust men sexually, don't entice them or put yourself in a situation where he will want sex and then you just abruptly stop and then you turn around cry foul. that's not how life works.


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## Matt Derrick

PotBellyFatGuy said:


> yes the typical male wants to have sex with women whenever possible. of course that is obvious which is why "the internet is for porn." sex sells bigtime and men are the ones chasing the women. with this basic fact that the world openly knows (and women take advantage of with hypergamy based on their sexual market value), i and my friends have NEVER raped any girl. we have never had a lack of impulse control or have hurt someone, either through breaking local laws or transgressing personal boundaries. we are horny but we are not rapists. if you turn on a guy and go "halfway" like your example story, what is he supposed to do? a vast majority (NOT myself included) would not be able to stop. is that considered rape or did you lead him on and then just expect him to turn off his sexual desire right there and then? he was likely very young too in his 20s. that's a toxic mix for a girl to call "rape." you invite these sexual situations with a man in his sexual prime and then just want it to end as if it is a class lecture or a transaction at a cash register. *you can't have it both ways*. you want to enjoy the sexual experience in the presence of a man - men, whose nature you know very well by default as per your own words - and then turn around and blame him for wanting to desire you. there is no compassion to feel. he did nothing wrong. women are the gatekeepers. if you don't trust men sexually, don't entice them or put yourself in a situation where he will want sex and then you just abruptly stop and then you turn around cry foul. that's not how life works.



this is a very common form of victim blaming. the sort answer to your query is that if either partner of a sexual interaction withdraws consent at _any _point, failing to stop after that consent is withdrawn is indeed sexual assault at a _minimum_, and more often than not ends up in a situation in which a rape occurs.



PotBellyFatGuy said:


> if you turn on a guy and go "halfway" like your example story, what is he supposed to do? a vast majority (NOT myself included) would not be able to stop. is that considered rape or did you lead him on and then just expect him to turn off his sexual desire right there and then?



again, the above applies. also, the theory that men 'cannot stop' once a sexual interaction is initiated is a myth and usually a result of social mis-education. what they are 'supposed to do' is respect the other person's wishes for the human being they are, not disregard them to pursue your own selfish pleasure at their expense.



PotBellyFatGuy said:


> you invite these sexual situations with a man in his sexual prime and then just want it to end as if it is a class lecture or a transaction at a cash register. *you can't have it both ways*. you want to enjoy the sexual experience in the presence of a man - men, whose nature you know very well by default as per your own words - and then turn around and blame him for wanting to desire you. there is no compassion to feel. he did nothing wrong. women are the gatekeepers. if you don't trust men sexually, don't entice them or put yourself in a situation where he will want sex and then you just abruptly stop and then you turn around cry foul. that's not how life works.



boy, there's a lot of incorrect thinking there, too much for me to unpack right now. i'm just going to say that these concepts are part of the problem as to why rape occurs so frequently in our culture. let's just say that telling women that they don't have a choice at any point after a sexual interaction has been initiated is false.

'a kiss is not a contract' is a saying that is often used here, and I think it describes this situation. i doesn't matter if they say no after the first kiss or right before you're about to orgasm. if a 'no' occurs at any point, it is your duty not just as a man (because these situations can occur between any combination of genders) but as a basic human being, to discontinue the interaction.

i'm not saying that you shouldn't feel upset or confused, or any other feelings you are feeling at that time when it happens, but you need to put your feelings and libido aside instead of blaming them for letting you get worked up.

i'm gonna stop there for now, but honestly, this is the kind of thinking we need to combat against. the fact that @Phuen marked your post as 'useful' is both extremely disappointing and also kind of frightening.


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## EmmaAintDead

I've been assaulted while hitching once by a stranger, but generally speaking when this has happened to me it has been people I know who did it. Especially after I'd come out as trans, men who were close to me must have seen that as some kind of an "in." You aren't alone, you'll never be alone, and as much as I wish nobody else could share in these feelings, a LOT of us can. 

Stay dangerous out there, loves. And don't let predators dictate how you live. We've got each other.


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## roughdraft

PotBellyFatGuy said:


> yes the typical male wants to have sex with women whenever possible. of course that is obvious which is why "the internet is for porn." sex sells bigtime and men are the ones chasing the women. with this basic fact that the world openly knows (and women take advantage of with hypergamy based on their sexual market value), i and my friends have NEVER raped any girl. we have never had a lack of impulse control or have hurt someone, either through breaking local laws or transgressing personal boundaries. we are horny but we are not rapists. if you turn on a guy and go "halfway" like your example story, what is he supposed to do? a vast majority (NOT myself included) would not be able to stop. is that considered rape or did you lead him on and then just expect him to turn off his sexual desire right there and then? he was likely very young too in his 20s. that's a toxic mix for a girl to call "rape." you invite these sexual situations with a man in his sexual prime and then just want it to end as if it is a class lecture or a transaction at a cash register. *you can't have it both ways*. you want to enjoy the sexual experience in the presence of a man - men, whose nature you know very well by default as per your own words - and then turn around and blame him for wanting to desire you. there is no compassion to feel. he did nothing wrong. women are the gatekeepers. if you don't trust men sexually, don't entice them or put yourself in a situation where he will want sex and then you just abruptly stop and then you turn around cry foul. that's not how life works.



I've fortunately only had to desist from continuing on in a hookup and go jerk myself off in the bushes or the bathroom on a couple of occasions and let me tell you - it was a lot less shameful than how I would imagine violating somebody.. you can't be for real man.


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## Phuen

*It is useful.* For example, just because assault and theft are wrong, doesn't mean it's okay to walk with your wallet and expensive phone out in poor neighborhoods. It's just being smart to consider risks.

*It's not victim blaming.* It's good advice that both women and men should heed. You flaunt it, you're asking for trouble. BE SMART ON THE ROAD. You're not at fault when you are the victim, but your new trauma may have been avoided!


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## roughdraft

Phuen said:


> *It is useful.* For example, just because assault and theft are wrong, doesn't mean it's okay to walk with your wallet and expensive phone out in poor neighborhoods. It's just being smart to consider risks.
> 
> *It's not victim blaming.* It's good advice that both women and men should heed. You flaunt it, you're asking for trouble. BE SMART ON THE ROAD. You're not at fault when you are the victim, but your new trauma may have been avoided!



look man, comparing a person being raped to a wallet or phone being stolen is just completely fuckin wrong.


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## EmmaAintDead

Phuen said:


> *It is useful.* For example, just because assault and theft are wrong, doesn't mean it's okay to walk with your wallet and expensive phone out in poor neighborhoods. It's just being smart to consider risks.
> 
> *It's not victim blaming.* It's good advice that both women and men should heed. You flaunt it, you're asking for trouble. BE SMART ON THE ROAD. You're not at fault when you are the victim, but your new trauma may have been avoided!


remember when OP specifically said they didnt want your shitty advice, broman?


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## Matt Derrick

Phuen said:


> *It is useful.* For example, just because assault and theft are wrong, doesn't mean it's okay to walk with your wallet and expensive phone out in poor neighborhoods. It's just being smart to consider risks.
> 
> *It's not victim blaming.* It's good advice that both women and men should heed. You flaunt it, you're asking for trouble. BE SMART ON THE ROAD. You're not at fault when you are the victim, but your new trauma may have been avoided!



oh boy. i feel like maybe i should hang back and let a woman answer this, but let's just say that we _should _be able to walk around flashing money everywhere and not expect to get robbed. just because that isn't our current reality doesn't mean that getting robbed is our fault.

take that an now *apply it to rape*. everyone _should _be able to wear whatever they want (or nothing at all) _without being raped_. just because that isn't our current reality doesn't mean it is the fault of the person who was raped.



Phuen said:


> It's not victim blaming.



what you are saying is, quite literally, the _definition _of victim blaming. please take some time to do more research on the subject and educate yourself.


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## Phuen

Phuen said:


> You're not at fault when you are the victim, but your new trauma may have been avoided!



Victim blaming is when you apply any fault to the victim. Which I do not.

This is reasonable advice that prevents people from becoming new victims. Most women are reasonable and agree with this. They don't victim blame, either. They just don't go around slapping tigers. Rapists are like tigers; don't expect reasoning or safety.


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## EmmaAintDead

@Phuen , You've had 9 posts and none of them have been worth reading. Please, for the love of god, let post #10 be "Goodbye I will never log into this site again"


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## KnifeToe

Much compassion to all the victims.


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## roughdraft

Phuen said:


> Victim blaming is when you apply any fault to the victim. Which I do not.
> 
> This is reasonable advice that prevents people from becoming new victims. Most women are reasonable and agree with this. They don't victim blame, either. They just don't go around slapping tigers. Rapists are like tigers; don't expect reasoning or safety.



you're in a thread started by a rape victim, saying you can speak for "most women", victim blaming, talking about slapping tigers. seriously, you are absolutely on the wrong website and you've gotta get a grip on reality


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## PotBellyFatGuy

Matt Derrick said:


> this is a very common form of victim blaming. the sort answer to your query is that if either partner of a sexual interaction withdraws consent at _any _point, failing to stop after that consent is withdrawn is indeed sexual assault at a _minimum_, and more often than not ends up in a situation in which a rape occurs.



like i said, the typical female wants it both ways. first she was a horny slut and all was well as her sexual desires were being fulfilled but then at any second, her brain said stop, and now she became the victim instead of the taker of pleasure that *she* herself invited. the hypocrisy is pathetic. it is pure insanity to think that sex is rational and that it can just be shut off in the middle of arousal (especially with a man in his sexual prime), just like that. at least admit that you wanted what you asked for and you got exactly that. i am not talking about the kid earlier in the post or the other girls here who were taken advantage of in a myriad of ways. that's not just rape but child abuse of a minor as well. i am talking about a girl who invites sexual activity and then turns around and cries #metoo!

this is the exact prime reason men have gone MGTOW and how feminism has changed the social dynamic in mainstream society of dating and marriage.


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## EmmaAintDead

Oh man I can't wait to see a ban tag on @PotBellyFatGuy after THAT doozy


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## dumpster harpy

PotBellyFatGuy said:


> like i said, the typical female wants it both ways. first she was a horny slut and all was well as her sexual desires were being fulfilled but then at any second, her brain said stop, and now she became the victim instead of the taker of pleasure that *she* herself invited. the hypocrisy is pathetic. it is pure insanity to think that sex is rational and that it can just be shut off in the middle of arousal (especially with a man in his sexual prime), just like that. at least admit that you wanted what you asked for and you got exactly that. i am not talking about the kid earlier in the post or the other girls here who were taken advantage of in a myriad of ways. that's not just rape but child abuse of a minor as well. i am talking about a girl who invites sexual activity and then turns around and cries #metoo!
> 
> this is the exact prime reason men have gone MGTOW and how feminism has changed the social dynamic in mainstream society of dating and marriage.


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## blank

PotBellyFatGuy said:


> this is the exact prime reason men have gone MGTOW and how feminism has changed the social dynamic in mainstream society of dating and marriage.



I think that has more to do with them thinking it sounds better to say "oh I just avoid women because reasons" than "oh yeah I'm weird and nobody likes me".


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## Phuen

blank said:


> I think that has more to do with them thinking it sounds better to say "oh I just avoid women because reasons" than "oh yeah I'm weird and nobody likes me".




Most guys go #MGTOW because of a brutal divorce, where often the mother won't let the father see his kids anymore, but still pay for it and her new boyfriend. It's more common than you think. Men get abused a plenty.

Abuse is unacceptable, from either gender and to either gender. Whether it's from the government or any group of people.


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## EmmaAintDead

the next male who starts talking about men going their own way I will personally beat


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## Jackthereaper

EmmaAintDead said:


> the next male who starts talking about men going their own way I will personally beat


In checkers?


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## Older Than Dirt

"Men Going Their Own Way" seems to mean very toxic misogynists ... avoiding women?!

Seems like a win/win- they should be _encouraged_ to go their own way, _very far away_ from women.

Since women post here, and feminist opinions abound, i think StP is a place that "MGTOW" should avoid like the plague- it just isn't the "safe space" these very delicate men need. Everyone, including them, will be better off if these "men" don't post here anymore.


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## roughdraft

Phuen said:


> Most guys go #MGTOW because of a brutal divorce, where often the mother won't let the father see his kids anymore, but still pay for it and her new boyfriend. It's more common than you think. Men get abused a plenty.
> 
> Abuse is unacceptable, from either gender and to either gender. Whether it's from the government or any group of people.



yes the brutal divorce/swindling thing is fucked up, beyond fucked up, I have seen it happen and I could not agree more, it is one of many things that forms the crux of the modern bastardization of marriage (in my opinion) but you are wayyyyy overgeneralizing - what makes you think that YOU know why ´most guys´ do, whatever they do?

As well nobody is justifying abuse of any gender - except for @PotBellyFatGuy - so I want to ask, why are you bringing this argument here?


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## PotBellyFatGuy

roughdraft said:


> yes the brutal divorce/swindling thing is fucked up, beyond fucked up, I have seen it happen and I could not agree more, it is one of many things that forms the crux of the modern bastardization of marriage (in my opinion) but you are wayyyyy overgeneralizing - what makes you think that YOU know why ´most guys´ do, whatever they do?
> 
> As well nobody is justifying abuse of any gender - except for @PotBellyFatGuy - so I want to ask, why are you bringing this argument here?



justifying abuse of gender? um, i clearly said when a girl invites sexual advances, SHE WANTS it. this is not abuse. abuse is what the people talked about when they are taken advantage of, as in being minors and not knowing what is going on, or in cases where they are drugged, etc. where exactly is your reading comprehension skill in stating i am justifying abuse?


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## PotBellyFatGuy

Older Than Dirt said:


> "Men Going Their Own Way" seems to mean very toxic misogynists ... avoiding women?!
> 
> Seems like a win/win- they should be _encouraged_ to go their own way, _very far away_ from women.
> 
> Since women post here, and feminist opinions abound, i think StP is a place that "MGTOW" should avoid like the plague- it just isn't the "safe space" these very delicate men need. Everyone, including them, will be better off if these "men" don't post here anymore.



not to take that i live in the U.S. for granted and not shit russia, north korea, or any sharia law based nation, i am extremely grateful that my side of the story can be heard. i am not here to justify mgtow or anti-feminism or whatever. i am simply saying what i see from my perspective and my views are allowed to be heard. i never put a gun to anyone's head and said agree or die. i merely wanted to voice how men think. we are horny and in the midst of invited sexual encounters, we should not be asked to turn our erections off and the intense carnal desire of sex. you don't have to agree with it of course, at least not publicly due to excoriation by the outrage mob, but ask any girl who has had an incredible time with a real man who has dominated her in bed (and she wanted it, i am not talking about forced acts obviously). it was AMAZING. no girl dreams of a beta male or a sissy encounter when it comes to sex. not a single one. 

too bad this generation of women has been taught that when a man dominates and rules over her (NOT in an abusive way obviously), it is seen as something bad instead of a mere gender role while they are there to nurture and support them as leaders of the household. everything has become about equality when it's simply not possible. men and women think very differently and it isn't a competition but a complementation. mainstream social justice propaganda won't allow for it which is why so many laws have been put into place that have destroyed nuclear families by making laws against men. not just fake #metoo cries but divorce rape, no child custody, automatic guilt before innocence, i can go on. 

message to women: there is nothing wrong with being feminine and appreciating "what makes us girls," like brittany pettibone says in the title of her book. ditch the social justice kool-aid.


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## PotBellyFatGuy

blank said:


> I think that has more to do with them thinking it sounds better to say "oh I just avoid women because reasons" than "oh yeah I'm weird and nobody likes me".



then why are powerful men refusing to mentor women in the business world? too much #metoo risk. remember that men are judged based on their resources they bring to the table while women are based on youth, fertility, and chastity. doesn't matter if a guy isn't hot as long as he is wealthy and powerful in society. they can get girls. but they are walking away due to major risks, even outside of #metoo. divorce is easily an option in today's world. and every man loses in divorce. cases abound (google them or see the videos on youtube) where judges are forcing men to pay child support for children who aren't even theirs, as proven by DNA tests.


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## Older Than Dirt

PotBellyFatGuy: You are a moron, a scumbag, a vile person, and probably have never had sex, and will never have sex in your life, without paying a woman who is revolted by your disgusting presence, or raping. 

You are clearly also, in your own misogynist lingo, a "beta".

Because you understand that no woman would ever voluntarily have sex with you without getting paid, and that all women sense what a shit person you are, and are revolted by you, you spin out masturbatory fantasies (fueled by your obsessive porn-viewing) about "what women [that alien species that stopped talking to you by middle school] want".

Those of us with actual experience of "what women want" just stare aghast.

Die in a fire.


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## PotBellyFatGuy

Older Than Dirt said:


> PotBellyFatGuy: You are a moron, a scumbag, a vile person, and probably have never had sex, and will never have sex in your life, without paying a woman who is revolted by your disgusting presence, or raping.
> 
> You are clearly also, in your own misogynist lingo, a "beta".
> 
> Because you understand that no woman would ever voluntarily have sex with you without getting paid, and that all women sense what a shit person you are, and are revolted by you, you spin out masturbatory fantasies (fueled by your obsessive porn-viewing) about "what women [that alien species that stopped talking to you by middle school] want".
> 
> Those of us with actual experience of "what women want" just stare aghast.
> 
> Die in a fire.



you are not in the 5th grade. you don't need to make personal insults to get your point across. especially as an older man. what am i supposed to do now? make fun of you and figure out some names i can call you? does this make sense to you?

i come from a traditional culture with clear gender roles. we don't have issues that american men are having with the anti-masculine propaganda being peddled alongside a good dose of feminism. women want to be dominated by men. they won't come out and say it because it is simply not politically correct to do so.


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## Older Than Dirt

They are not "personal insults", they are responses to _your_ vile thoughts that _you_ have posted. I don't otherwise know you from a hole in the ground. And you just keep digging your misogynist hole with your last post.

I too come from a traditional culture with clear gender roles; it's called America.

In this culture, one of our traditions is that persons of all genders are entitled to use lethal force on sub-neanderthals like you, when you pursue sex the way we know you do from your posts here.

In case it is not clear to you (because it is clear you are dumb as a rock), i am not seeking a discussion with you.

"What you are supposed to do now" is die in two fires, or at the hands of the next woman you try to rape.


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## PotBellyFatGuy

Older Than Dirt said:


> They are not "personal insults", they are responses to _your_ vile thoughts that _you_ have posted. I don't otherwise know you from a hole in the ground. And you just keep digging your misogynist hole with your last post.
> 
> I too come from a traditional culture with clear gender roles; it's called America.
> 
> In this culture, all genders are entitled to use lethal force on sub-neanderthals like you, when you pursue sex the way we know you do from your posts here.
> 
> In case it is not clear to you (because it is clear you are dumb as a rck), i am not seeking a discussion with you.
> 
> "What you are supposed to do now" is die in two fires, or at the hands of the next woman you try to rape.



america in 1950 is not america today. there is a VERY BIG difference in cultural norms in this country today. there is no way an ad like that from gillette a few months ago would have been shown in america in the past. on top of that, women and minorities are being celebrated, hence the attack on the straight white male. these things were not america 70 years ago. we didn't have women growing out armpit hair, dying it purple, becoming fat and disgusting and being proud of it too, then becoming trigglypuff at social gatherings. and this insanity is celebrated! absolutely crazy.

you are calling me a moron and some other names. dude, that's personal. if you want to attack an argument, state its flaws instead of anything about who i am. again, as an older man, why should i have to teach you this basic skill of differentiating ad hominem? you should know these things at your age.


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## Older Than Dirt

Dear fat moron: I do in fact have the capacity to construct a logical argument, what with the law school and what not. However, you a vile subhuman, and i am not trying to do so. It would be wasted on an imbecilic fuck like you.

You post under the name of "PotBellyFatGuy", and have the chutzpah to talk about women "becoming fat and disgusting and being proud of it too"? Pot-kettle issues?

Also, i _am_ an old guy. As you can see, i am 60. Those who finished second grade in my culture know i was not yet alive in 1950. i grew up in the '60s-'70s with a hardcore feminist mom.

Since you keep asking what you should do, you should delete your account. No one here is going to put up with your shit, especially in a thread about men like you.

The other thing you should do is step in front of a speeding truck or train today.

Also (and this will probably go over your head, because you are very stupid), an "ad hominem" argument does not take the form "PotBellyFatGuy is an imbecile lump of dogshit and a sub-species of nothing", but rather takes the form "The argument that PotBellyFatGuy makes is false _because_ PotBellyFatGuy is an imbecile lump of dogshit and a sub-species of nothing". I used to _teach_ logic, cretinous pustule.


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## Deleted member 24029

So, the Rape discussion thread has become the thread debating MGTOW? You know, for a community that needs things to stay on the tracks...
Next up, a thread with favorite quotes from Elliot Rodger?!?!
Jesus....


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## Matt Derrick

Wow, this got out of hand really quickly. Apologies to the thread starter for not banning this guy earlier.



Bey said:


> So, the Rape discussion thread has become the thread debating MGTOW? You know, for a community that needs things to stay on the tracks...
> Next up, a thread with favorite quotes from Elliot Rodger?!?!
> Jesus....



Agreed, let's get this thread back on track.


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## Redfoxes

Now seems like a good time to remind you all that not a single damn one of you is to blame for what happened. Whether you were into it at first or knew the person or were friends or in a relationship with them or even if they were a stranger. The thing is, that "tiger" bites whether it's been slapped or not. It was not your fault, and no one deserves that. And not a damn one of you was 'asking for it'. And everybody that's got a grain of common sense knows that too. There's a lot of good people and good times to be had out there. Don't let the bad ones dissuade you from going where you want or doing what you want to do.


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## roguetrader

unbelievable - any time a girl / woman has said 'no further' I have respected their wishes without any sense of frustration / injustice or any kind of negative feeling - to be granted ANY level of intimacy / closeness with a partner is a beautiful thing and my 'right to satisfaction' is not even remotely a consideration.....


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## roguetrader

P.S I just accidentally 'Liked' a post made by Potbelly Dickhead above, and am having trouble undoing the rating on my phone.... for the record I just gotta say I agree with none of his vile, sexist nonsense...


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## roughdraft

that dude was fuckin dumb and trust me I am a super dumbass... it isn't hard to understand the enjoyment in being sexually dominated VS not giving consent.... good riddance


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## benton

I've only read the original post thus far.

I like the attitude of the original poster.

The longer that I live, the more and more I recognize just how much of human behavior is predatory in nature. I've got my ideas about where this comes from, but that's for another thread.

It seems to me that the OP has the mindset to rise above.


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## Pokebert

I saw the shitstorm that was this thread and thought I’d pop in again having been on the road, as a nonbinary person that presents androgynous (note that I’m bio-male and therefore often get interpreted as a gay man):

I was sexually harassed/assaulted by a driver and honestly froze when it happened. The best way to avoid it is to listen to your gut, but if you find yourself in a situation like that be ready to fight. 
It can happen if you’re a man or a woman or anything in between... FROM a man or a woman or anything in between. I’ve known plenty of women that have been raped or sexually assaulted as well as men. Don’t ever assume that it can’t happen to you.

Stand up for those on the road who have faced sexual harassment or assault. Do not EVER treat them badly because “they were asking for it” or “they shouldn’t have taken the ride if they felt sketched out” or “well they’re a man so they should’ve liked it/they should’ve fought back”.


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