# So, whose into anarchism/permaculture/primitive skills/anarchism/fermentation...



## hassysmacker

So, whose really into anarchism/permaculture/primitive skills/fermentation/rewilding/naturalism/environmentalism/rewilding/herbalism/radical analysis of things like gender roles/etc etc etc as well as traveling?

I mean obviously this doesn't preclude you from enjoying getting drunk, or busking, or spanging, or whatever, but who isn't an obnoxious jerkface, and is actually passionate about some or all of the things I just listed (as opposed to just getting drunk allll the time)?

Just curious, as I am one of those people. And that being said, I don't necessarrily have a problem with people who don't fall into this category, as I have plenty of friends who don't, but I figure it's nice to know who shares similar interests.


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## Mouse

I'm into a few of those things... but being into ALL of that seems like a headache lol

hey look! it's my eye! haha


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## hassysmacker

Its not a headache, it's being wicked excited about all of it! Which is why I'm worktrading on this permaculture farm till I hit the road again in September! And of course I'm not doing all those things all the time (though quite often), it's just stuff that I'm generally interested in and pursue, as opposed to it just being a notion.


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## Mouse

well duh. to ME it would seem like a headache. then again, I'm more into art and media.. but hte good thing about that is that I can gear my creative efforts toward new things I learn/want to learn. It's just that right now I'm ass deep in learning about art and media by itself. lol


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## Gudj

hassysmacker said:


> So, whose really into anarchism/permaculture/primitive skills/fermentation/rewilding/naturalism/environmentalism/rewilding/herbalism/radical analysis of things like gender roles/etc etc etc as well as traveling?
> 
> I mean obviously this doesn't preclude you from enjoying getting drunk, or busking, or spanging, or whatever, but who isn't an obnoxious jerkface, and is actually passionate about some or all of the things I just listed (as opposed to just getting drunk allll the time)?
> 
> Just curious, as I am one of those people. And that being said, I don't necessarrily have a problem with people who don't fall into this category, as I have plenty of friends who don't, but I figure it's nice to know who shares similar interests.


 
Up the punxwhocare!
Or... non-punks. Especially non-punks I guess.

Sorry for not replying to your PM.


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## utensil

Oh hell yeah. My goal traveling this summer is to meet more punx who care!!! Where is the permaculture farm you're working on?


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## hassysmacker

I'm currently at the Commonweal garden site of the Regenerative Design Institute (Regenerative Design Institute) in Bolinas, CA. Certainly not a radical or punk or anarchist place, but learning tons and that makes it worth it! So I get outta here in a month, and head...elsewhere?


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## uncivilize

hippy


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## BanMatt

Could you recommend any anarchist or radical organization where one could offer some sort of help/ volunteer work? Actually it doesnt have to be anarch/radical. Ive looked into a few farms and communes but never have luck with getting hooked up. Remember I'm a travel so I essentially have nothing but my legs and hands. But to answer your question, I am to an extent. I regret that fact that I never find like minded people who aren't elitist or something of the like. I just want to learn more and help on a farm or in impoverished areas without feeling like have to sell my soul to a group or be 100% just like 'em.


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## hassysmacker

As far as just learning the nitty gritty of organic farming, there is always WWOOFing. I cannot vouch for any specific farms, having not done it. But you pay $25 for a years access to their directory of organic farms looking for volunteers in exchange for room, board, and occasionally, a stipend. SOme are awesome, some are not, it's hard to tell whose who, as the directory does not a reviews/comments.

Unfortunately a lot of permaculture worktrades and internships and such want people to previously have taken a Permaculture Design Course which are typically a decent chunk of change.

There are primitive skills internships.

Basically, I have no specific answer to your question, ya just gotta look into it. Google volunteer and/or worktrade attached to whatever situation you're looking for: permaculture, organic farming, primitive skills, homesteading, whatever.


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## MrD

Gudj said:


> Up the punxwhocare!
> Or... non-punks. Especially non-punks I guess.



lol, I have seen WAY too much apathy in the "traveler community'" it is pretty fucking sad.
I am not really in to any of the "generic traveler" things (spanging, busking, drinking, ect.), it is boring....
And it's pretty shitty to travel with people who are, I guess that's why I travel alone most of the time =p

But yeah, I consider my self a primitivist of some sort. Dig allot of the things you listed.


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## hassysmacker

Anyone else? I know you're out there...


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## shwillyhaaa

me. :]


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## Detrivore

yes, all of the above. I tried fermenting grains for beer from a huge pile of wheat spilled off a grainer once to no avail. I have worked on a bunch of organic farms and as silly as it sounds on this thread, I always think "I wish punks were into this instead of hippys"

I don't care to articulate it that well right now but most of the earth-centric crowd lack the anger/politics that seem to make it all meaningful. Also hippys are lazy and talk slow and concentrate only on positive feelings.

A lot of what i used to value in dumpstering, hitchhiking, railriding, not working, living off excess of a city has been good training but ultimately I'd like to be responsibly embedded in a permaculture eventually.

I have been thinking about getting a new wwoof membership, if i do, I will let people PM me for the password to check on farms online.


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## BanMatt

I have had no luck being able to get hooked up on a farm through any website. I get really discourage because I hear all these stories of traveling kids doing it but I can't even come close to getting my foot in the door. Hell most of the time anyone I meet who is into any of the things mentioned above they treat me like I'm a conformed ignorant person or a scum fuck. Which I am neither. elitism is a bitch when all you want is to be informed and involved.


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## hassysmacker

detrivore: yeah i totally hear you about the hippy thing. about the solely positivizing thing, lacking appropriate rage against the state etc, thing, just a total lack of radical analysis. that being said, i'm currently nearing the end of a 6 month permaculture internship just north of SF, with regenerativedesign.org, and it's totally one of those places. however i'm learning and gaining so much from it that i'll be able to take away with me, so in the end its totally totally worth it. however that being said, i can;t wait to hit the road and head up towards the NW i think as of september...


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## BanMatt

Oh I also wanna add that if you are into all this look into sovereign citizenship. Study and read as MUCH as you can about it.
I suggest this book "Title 4 Flag Say's You're Schwag" by J.M. Sovereign Godsent


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## AmandaLynn

yes, interested in all of the above. 

I think it's a good point that dumpstering/hitching/hopping/busking whatever are really awesome ways to live off the excess of society but, you're still dependant on society in some form. Permaculture and sustainable lifestyle are where it's at! Unfortunatly that usually means not traveling. 

I've also seen some of that elitism, but I think it exists in every aspect of various counter-culture. It is tough to get into it first off because of dollars. I would also recommend WWOOF. I've noticed some wwoof farms that are just barely organic and really just want "free labor" but that's my only negative comment about wwoof. I'm not sure how to combat that elitism other than just be yourself and keep looking for a community where that's okay. If someone or a bunch of someones want to think they're better than everyone else than fuck them, I probably don't want to work/live/play with them anyway, right?

Fuck buying booze all the time. Hard cider is one of the simplest ferments you can do, mead is fairly simple too. Once again these require being in one place for a few weeks, or at the very least a car. 

As far a as feminism goes. Also yes. I see sexism in both the traveling and anarchist communities. It's just something I think everyone should be aware of in everyday interactions.

But anyways, hell yeah about caring about all these things, I used to not really just give a shit and travel, drink and bum around(which is totally fine and awesome in it's own way) but I've found that my travels have been so much more rewarding since getting involved in these things, and others too!!!


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## connerR

Shouldn't this be in Politics and Anarchism? 

Anyway, there was a time I was slightly into these things. That time has since passed.


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## stanktank

i'm with conner. for me it got to the point where a lot of kids i met who are into this sort of stuff are ONLY in to this sort of stuff and you can't really talk about anything else with them, almost uppity and prissy and elitist. No offense but to me it's just as bad as a person who's one dimensional about sports or religion or something. could i be wrong about those kids? absolutely, and i probably am. but regardless, that's how those folks felt to me and i just kinda moved on passed that.

That being said, you could probably get away with calling me one dimensional about music. so...touche.


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## BanMatt

I know what you mean stank. Like you'd ask "so you see *whatever* movie" and they something like " no man I dont watch movies, its just a way for corporations to get money and the masses to dumb themselves down". Cant make shit for conversation with some of them.


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## connerR

What killed it for me? Two words: anarchist bookfair.


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## Detrivore

yeah dude. thats totally understandable. Condescending anarchists or neo feral, anti-civ people lecturing you to drink yerba mate instead of coffee or something.

SOCIALLY I have never liked being in anarchist, organic permaculture crowds, or even punks. My friends don't really subscribe to any of these things wholly. But there are a lot of interesting ideas and to find the more sincere people to find is harder. 

I think all these life styles reflect trying to find a more authentic way of living outside of capitalism/ mass culture (which is pretty aligned with the ideas of punk, or this board) just the majority of people you first run into are super-idealist trying to write some college thesis or something and are all about being so pure in their ideals. The same people that annoy me usually give up on their ideas and "sell out" in some form in a few years anyway. But I am trying to figure out how a good way to live the rest of my life is, and some of these things make sense.


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## SparrowW

I've been getting more and more into all these things. I'm trying so hard to not be put-off by all the "Oh you're just some stupid teen girl poser" I keep running into. It sucks that you see all these people who talk about anarchism especially being this group thing and how it's so family like, but all I find is people telling me to fuck off. Or the elitist ones who are 'all or nothing' and you are either completely devoted to taking everything completely literally or you just suck.

Besides those people though it's all really interesting and has a lot of good stuff to learn.


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## Shade

ya im down with almos tthe whole list,ive never gotten a chance to stay on a organic farm im moving around to much , but i did dabble in growing a few fruits and veggies in compost piles and stuff, and most of all the rewilding/primative aspect is my favorite, humans are veering to far off , forgetting old traits and methods of surviving,living in the wilderness , beingself reliant, all we can do is keep it alive


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## hassysmacker

amandalynn: right on with the criticism of dumpstering/living on the excess thing. it's great to do given the existence of modern industrial society, but at the end of the day, i'm interested in subverting this way of being, and human relationship to nonhumans. so, yeah you'll find me dumsptering and busking and such while I can, but I'm actively struggling for a different world, and relearning these skills is an important part of that! pretty much everything you said is definitely right on. and i got a gallon strawberry mead brewing as we speak :-D.

stank: while i'm sure there are people like that, there reall are in all subsets of people, that are solely interested in thm and solely their range of opinions/activities. however, rest assured, not all people into the things i listed are! i love drinking and i'll hang out with you under a bridge any time, and theres plenty of other things for me to talk about, but its definitely gotta be primarily not about rollies and booze and flying signs, and how good these things are in so or so town. not directing any of those things at you, just sayin' about a lot of the kids i run into.

detrivore/wayward: yeah fucking fuck purists.


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## uncivilize

I think it's alright for folks to be passionate about these things, even to the point of it taking over their lives, after all, these skills ARE all about life, the things that actually allow us to live: hunting, gathering, cultivating, preserving, clothing, shelter, etc. Also, many of these skills are fun, and require skill, and have as many techniques as practitioners, so people into these things like to "talk shop." I tend to find a great deal of people's ideas of "entertainment" to be pointless and uninteresting, to each their own I guess. Fuck elitism though! If someone wants to learn something I know, and aren't a total waste of life, I'm down to share.


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## AmandaLynn

I just don't understand where people get the idea that primative skills and lots of dollars go together at all. 

Rivercane and falling leaves(earthskills rendezvous) are 210 dollars each.
Firefly gathering is 100-200 dollars(props to them for having a pretty big sliding scale though)
Rabbitstick and Winter Count are 275-300
The list goes on and on.

The only gathering I've found that doesn't care about dollars is The Burdock Gathering in Maine. I've never been, but plan on going this year. Burdock has all the same things going as the bigger expensive gatherings(food, camping, skilshare)I don't understand why we can't just take dollars out of the equation. I know a lot of the people getting into the re-wilding movement from Asheville are still very much a part of mainstream society and therefore dollars. I've also heard rumor of a gathering in the Pisgah Nat. Forest, month long and skillshare, if you know teach, if you don't, learn. 

I can't say if the big gatherings show a lot of elitism because I've never been able to afford to go. I don't want to judge without observation. If someone's been I'd really like to hear what you thought/observed etc.


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## BanMatt

AmandaLynn said:


> I just don't understand where people get the idea that primative skills and lots of dollars go together at all.
> 
> Rivercane and falling leaves(earthskills rendezvous) are 210 dollars each.
> Firefly gathering is 100-200 dollars(props to them for having a pretty big sliding scale though)
> Rabbitstick and Winter Count are 275-300
> The list goes on and on.
> 
> The only gathering I've found that doesn't care about dollars is The Burdock Gathering in Maine. I've never been, but plan on going this year. Burdock has all the same things going as the bigger expensive gatherings(food, camping, skilshare)I don't understand why we can't just take dollars out of the equation. I know a lot of the people getting into the re-wilding movement from Asheville are still very much a part of mainstream society and therefore dollars. I've also heard rumor of a gathering in the Pisgah Nat. Forest, month long and skillshare, if you know teach, if you don't, learn.
> 
> I can't say if the big gatherings show a lot of elitism because I've never been able to afford to go. I don't want to judge without observation. If someone's been I'd really like to hear what you thought/observed etc.


 

What do you mean gatherings care about money? like really Im asking im ignorant on this.


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## UrbanNokizaru

I'm down with these things 'cept fermentation I don't really care about that at all. I'm primarily into anarchy and everything else stems from that, recently I've been doing a lot of feminist reading and analysis of relationships around me (shit is fucked). I try to make changes when I can, they're usually small and only affect people around me but it all helps I feel. I feel the same way about not enough punks trying their hand at this, we bring a totally different vibe that I enjoy a bit more. A lot of people just don't care enough to do anything more than talk about it and whine though which is kinda demoralizing when you wanna start a project and people would rather sit on their asses and watch tv or some shit...


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## hassysmacker

(banmatt: she was just talking about how most prim skills gatherings and stuff cost money to get in)

So I understand the sentiment of "why can't we just take money out of the whole equation", and that's why as radicals (if we identify as such), it's our responsibility to attempt to circumvent the money for education model with offerings such as free skools, skillshares, rewild camps, etc. But at the same time, most of the teachers at these places have dedicated their lives to teaching these skills, and really, their prices are not that insane (100-150 for a 2 day intensive, camping, workshop etc.). Within the context of a capitalist economy, you're gonna have to do something for money, and if these people are making fair and decent amounts of money teaching primitive skills, fucking awesome for them that they don't have to have a shitty part time job too. And at these gatherings, theres a bajillion of these teachers, other people interested in these things to network/connect with, lots of supplies, dank fucking food, all for 3-8 days! 3-8 DAYS! (depending on the gathering of course). Of course the food COULD be dumpstered, but for people not necessarily into dumpstering, and also, sometimes with people wanting to guarantee good, organic food, if you've ever done the calculations of feeding lots of people for several days, it really does add up. So 210 dollars or whatever, really isn't that much for the food, and the amount of education that you get.

All this being said, some of these gatherings I havent gone to, and then have probably complained, because at the time, I didn't have the money.

But, ya know what y'all? I know a lot of you have foodstamps, and spange and/or busk from time to time, and while I realize it's hit or miss, I know, and you know, how easy it can be to make money if you're dedicated. So 210 bucks or thereabouts? Really(!) not that bad. How much money have YOU seen people cumulatively go through on beer and cigarettes?

Also, I have never ever EVER run into any sort of elitism in my experience with convergences/gatherings. If you have a genuine curiosity and interest in learning these skills, there is no shortage of people there that want to help turn you on to them!

And Urban, fermentation is really awesome in terms of staying healthy and promoting micro flora and fauna in your stomach. So, it's good shit! And transforming food into more healthful versions of themselves that can be preserved, is fun (to me anyway, hah)! But to each their own.


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## BigRockCandyMountain

hassysmacker said:


> So, whose really into anarchism/permaculture/primitive skills/fermentation/rewilding/naturalism/environmentalism/rewilding/herbalism/radical analysis of things like gender roles/etc etc etc as well as traveling?
> 
> I mean obviously this doesn't preclude you from enjoying getting drunk, or busking, or spanging, or whatever, but who isn't an obnoxious jerkface, and is actually passionate about some or all of the things I just listed (as opposed to just getting drunk allll the time)?
> 
> Just curious, as I am one of those people. And that being said, I don't necessarrily have a problem with people who don't fall into this category, as I have plenty of friends who don't, but I figure it's nice to know who shares similar interests.



I am quite into Primitive Skills,Herbalism and Fermentation.I also am into hunting,fishing and wildcrafting as food sources.

I grew up half my life on different farms in the sticks and learning to survive in the woods as well as living off the land was part of growing up for me especially since most of my family is of Native American heritage and still have a strong connection to the land and living off of it.I was also in the boy scouts and it laid the base for my skills.I moved to the city when I was about 14 and its a metro area but its surrounded by woods and wildlife including deer will wander through downtown areas, its a unique place here.If I wander just outside the metro theres nothing but woodlands and farmlands for hours with the occasional small town to break up the monotony.

Even after moving to the city I continued to hone my skills.

I can build many types of traps using natural or found materials for all sorts of animals,catch fish with many methods including with my bare hands, and can start fires uses numerous methods.I always carry a survival knife with a cord wrapped handle on me as well as a fire piston that I wear around my neck on a lanyard.I have always lived off the land and will always do so, its in my blood.

As for herbalism I am quite skilled in it and am able to make a wide variety of medicines using herbs native to many area but since I grew up in the midwest my skills are best here.I know all major medicinal plants as well as their dosages, effects and method of delivery.

As for fermentation my skills are basic, I can make different types of alcohol, I can distill it into strong spirits and it's usually fairly good but Im not an expert winemaker or anything like that.Ive made beer,wine and spirits in the past.I dont drink much these days.

Ive always been an earthy kind of person and have always been more inclined to the wilderness.


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## ayron

arrrr i be one of these people down for such thingssss arrrg


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## hassysmacker

bigrockcandymountain: awesome awesome awesome! but, just so you know theres all types of fermnetation for foods, ranging from sauerkraut to miso to sourdough to much much wierder things! i highly recommend the book WIld Fermentation by Sandor Katz.


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## BigRockCandyMountain

Ive never tried to ferment food other than making yogurt. Its interesting as a preservation technique. I've certainly eaten my share of fermented foods. Kimchi and sauerkraut are among my favorite foods but I always imagined it'd bee quite complex and difficult so I never even looked into fermenting foods. I'll certainly check out wild fermentation, when I get the chance.

So since you say much much weirder things, I have ask, How weird does it get at the weirdest when it comes to fermented foods youve seen or heard of?


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## hassysmacker

dude! fermnetation can be soo easy! do nopt think its difficult. for sauerkaruat you slice cabbage, add salt, massage it till a brine comes out, and weight cabbage down so it stays submerged in brine, and let sit for 3 day+. That simple!

Get that book, but its so simple.

And well, I've heard about burying a whole rabbit in a hole and letting it ferment over the course of a month and then eat it? Theres making beer by chewing corn and adding saliva corn balls to water. Lots of wierd stuff!

Fermentation often makes foods MORE healthful then in its original state due to lactobacilli bacteria (hence lactofermnation)


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## AmandaLynn

hahaha Wild Fermentation is a fucking awesome book!!!! I got to meet Sandor at Short Mountain Sanctuary this spring, really really really really inspiring to drink a glass of his boucha and a bowl of his kraut. It's all absurdly simple to do. Even on the road you can carry around a mason jar of sprouts. My favorite are lentils and mung beans, they make a fucking tasty , cheap, power snack and they're super cheap. And they only take about three days to sprout.(I know this isn't exactly fermentation but it's the closest I've gotten to it while leather tramppin) 

I was on a communities tour on an RV earlier this summer, and the apple cider dumpster gods were smiling down on us. We found a gallon(in the fancy glass jar) or organic apple juice in the dumpster our first week of the tour. Three weeks later we had hard cider and three and a half weeks later we found 2 more gallons in the dumpster. This little cycle kept up for the whole two months, and we always had a suppy of dumpster booze. We made a gallon of strawberry mead with wild yeast from apples and tupelo honey from the sevenanda dumpster in Atlanta. 

I hear what yer sayin about why it costs so many dollars to go to those gatherings, and I'm also really glad to hear that you haven't seen any elitism at them. I guess if I really really really wanted to go to one I could rage up the funds, but the other problem is traveling with people who only kind of want to go and don't feel like raising funds. I mean I guess at that point you could just peace out but that situation hasn't worked out for me quite yet. I want to go to the mead circles at earthskills pretty freakin bad. Also at national rainbow gatherings all the Asheville folks who run earthskills set up Green Paths/Wild and Alive kitchen, pretty awesome vibes there.


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## hassysmacker

yeah wild fermentation is one of my favorites ever. i am currently making:
starwberry mead, ginger beer, sourdough starter for bread and other things, andean chewed corn beer, bouza (ancient egyptian sourdough based beer. soon to make more lactofermented soda, possibly apple cider mead (cyser), and more stuff, presumably. 

And yeah sprouts on the road....awesome idea! super healthy not all that filling though! My newest idea for road food is pemmican!

yeah theres lots of awesome stuff out there in the asheville area, i'm not gonna be there till next spring or so though, gonna be in the NW and SW till late winter...

but yeah, about the one could just travel with people who are more than a little interested in these things notion, is sort of why I'm posting this! My ulterior motive is I'm hitting the road again in weeks, and want to figure out whose into similar things as me, haha. So anyone whose interested in meeting up (gonna be leaving the bay area heading north) feel free to PM me!


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## Kalalau

When I get back to kalalau.. I might keep some goats for milk... how hard is it to make kefir with raw goat milk?.. I recently made saurkraut.. it was pretty good, and been doing fermented mung daal dosha for quite awhile.. it's pretty simple... My sister's a naturopathic doctor and has been selling me on fermenting stuff for awhile now.... anyone got a gingerbeer plant? I have a friend up here that wants one.


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## pigeon

i love this thread! i have no real need for fermenting because i don't drink but me and my boyfriend are super into the rest of your list! we're in tucson and have had a pretty hard time finding people that are also into similar things like the stuff you listed. glad to here its out there and that people still care! i never even thought to look around on here for other kids into primitive skills and rewilding (duh).


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## uncivilize

There are ways you can go to some primitive skills gatherings for free if you know their "system." (If you know, don't post it in the open). Just don't be an asshole and eat the food, get food stamps or something and pack your own in. The people who paid and made it possible for the event to take place at the very least deserve to eat enough.


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## uncivilize

wtf, you can't edit? oh well.

There's elitism anywhere you go, but all in all, the folks at the gathering are there to share skills, many out of a desire to help others reconnect and return to a healthier way of living, some are just trying to make a living, but it's definitely a good experience for those interested in learning. Don't forget, there can be additional materials fees, as little as a couple bucks, and I've seen it as high as $100 for a bow.


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## hassysmacker

kalaulau: Kefir is super easy to make. Add kefir grains to liquid of choice. Wait. The end. And ginger beer plant? You just need to grow ginger root! You use good ol regular ginger root for ginger beer. Making some right now!


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## Hollywood

ya know i am


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## christa

I just recently tried to ferment cabbage (kimchi) and my cabbage molded in five days! realized that you have to have the liquid above the cabbage or it will mold. 
Also I understand that going to a skill share would be an amazing thing but I have met several people traveling that are into permaculture, fermintation, brewing... and are more than willing to share their skills. There are also tons of books on these topics and if you have access to internet tons of tutorial videos too. I would agree that 200 dollars is a lot to save up and to blow on less than a week camp out but i believe there are definate ways around it. Doesn't this topic revolve around being self sufficient and DIY? Some of the best home brewers I know are self taught and had to go through a lot of trial and error to figure out their best recipies. What I'm saying is you don't have to go through a camp or skill share to get a basic knowledge of these topics. I would much prefer to spend my money on equipment for brewing or fermentation than a camp (although a skill share would be awesome!)


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## christa

I also understand the fustration of traveling for miles and not meeting any kids who's lives don't revolve around drinking and getting fucked up. But at the same time I sympathize because the way kids are growing up today is fucked up and alcoholism and narcotic abuse is widespread and is a disease, and should be treated as such. I feel that a lot of the kids I've met that have fit this scumbag stereotype would be into healthy diy projects if exposed, but have also deep seeded issues that prevent them from doing such.


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## uncivilize

christa said:


> I feel that a lot of the kids I've met that have fit this scumbag stereotype would be into healthy diy projects if exposed, but have also deep seeded issues that prevent them from doing such.



My ultimate goal is reach out to kids like that, but also anyone else whose finances are an obstacle to learning these skills.


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## Hollywood

hassysmacker said:


> My newest idea for road food is pemmican!


 
yeah pemmican! i have wanted to make this forever now but getting a hold of a decent amount of tallow is something i haven't figured out yet.


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## veggieguy12

I'm very interested to see an end to the unsustainable, destructive, Civilized way that has been overrunning and decimating this planet. I'm not so interested in learning the skills for creating a sustainable, harmonious world after The Fall.
Anyone can check through some of my posts under threads of this subject to get a sense of my perspective. I like chess and strategy, not gardening; I'm interested in guns, but not primitive tracking and hunting.

I have met some people more or less like-minded, and would be happy to do so again. I go all around the country, but I'm not online too much these days, so you can PM me a phone number (or an email, which I use more often than STP), and I'll get in touch with you.


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## hassysmacker

Well, ya know Captain, I respect that completely. For myself, I am incredibly interested in both! We all have talents, and they can all be used. In the fight against civilization, we really do need it all. People bringing it down, and the people dedicated to figuring out how humans CAN live in touch with our landbase again. So, follow what calls you!


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## Kalalau

hmm... I guess I'm not into either. But I do like chess. I don't have much of an interest in ending our destructive society, and I'm not so interested in the survival techniques after the fall. But I do like making my own kimchee, and I do like tempeh. If I am into hunting and gardening it has nothing to do with society at all, but my own selfish self indulgence. I do conservation work as a volunteer, but that's because I love the place, and I like projects. Not for some ethical reason. I also feel like I'm taking a big bite, but not so much that I can't chew.

I'm not a follower of Jesus, or Buddha or Lao Tzu, or arjuna..., but I like what these guys did, and I try to do what they did, for the reasons that they did what they did. Even if my action is totally different.. I'd hate do die for an idea, but wouldn't mind dying doing the right thing in the right place at the right time. Ideas are like money, they're transient, and based on faith.... and lord knows we've got enough transients around here.. 

Gingerbeer plant is sort of like a kombucha plant, and has nothing to do with ginger beer. (a poor name in my opinion)... 
I'm thinking that every hobo ought to know how to make hooch... for 6 bucks in food stamps it's 5 gallons of wine... a person could travel the country and set up batches along the way... and party all the way back through.... I've got 5 gallons waiting for me when I get home.


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## hassysmacker

huh what? gingerbeer plant? kombucha plant?! these things ain't plants! they're respectively a ginger bug (which is bubbly fermented ginger root sugar water g. beer starter), and kombucha which is a SCOBY (symbioptic colony of bacteria and yeast) and it sort of looks like a jellyfish a little.

and ya know, its fine that you're just into these things for the sake of being into them as how-to things, not with a larger ideological framework around it having to do with being anti civilization,

i, definitely do have that framework though!


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## finn

Kombucha plant? Bwahahahaha! I have to use that now!


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## Kalalau

..... I'm pretty sure about the gingerbeer plant..

but I messed up on the kombucha plant.... it must be an animal because it has babies.. or it's actually a CHUD (cannibalistic human underground... wait a minute)
wrong acronym same intention.

seems like a lot of it has misleading labels


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## hassysmacker

I promise you, the video you just sent me, is just a jar with ginger root, sugar, and water in it, fermenting, and bubbling.

I promise you! I'm making ginger beer as we speak!


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## anne

I'm into most things relating to sustainable living and self-sufficiency. I have at least a general interest in most of the things mentioned here, except fermentation because I don't eat/drink/buy salt, milk, alcohol, grains or refined sugar. Although, eventually I might like to learn how to make apple cider vinegar for hair conditioner and house cleaning. 

My most active interests right now are composting/humanure, rainwater harvesting/greywater recycling, and researching permaculture & aquaponics for when I buy land and can start growing my own food. Living in a truck makes that part sort of difficult right now since there are low light conditions inside and no good places to attach planters or anything like that outside the truck or trailer. If I can find a long term parking spot, hopefully I'll have more options for things like that. 

I'd also really like to learn how to make soap from animal fat and ashes.


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## hassysmacker

For apple cider vinegar, put apple cider in a containter with a cloth over it to keep flies/dust out, open. It will sooner or later turn into aple cider vinegar. Easiest kind of ferment there is.

Awesome thing that your into.

Though I'm interested to know why you won't use salt? Even for probiotic lactoferment making (such as sauerkraut, pickling, etc.)


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## anne

I don't like it because it makes me feel like crap, especially the morning after eating salted food since I'm not used to it. It's like a hangover. So I'm not anti-salt or anything, I'm just personally not into it. 

In theory, sauerkraut doesn't sound so bad but I've only tried it once or maybe twice and that was something like 18 years ago.


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## anyways

(raises hand tentatively)

I have interest in those things, yes. I'd ideally like to travel with books on all the edible shit that grows in all regions of the country, and also learn how to do some urban guerrilla gardening... I also really want to learn to kill and skin and use all parts of animals... Never done more than catch a fish in my life  

This to me seems problematic because when the system DOES fall in on itself and I'm still around and all I know how to do is live off the waste of society...and society stops producing waste.... I want to know how to survive.

It does my heart good to hear other kids talking about giving a fuck, and wanting to do more than just drink all day every day. 
I have yet to meet anyone in real life like that. 

...which is probably another reason why I'm so far from where I want to be with my learnings and skills... I've been giving up and getting drunk a lot.  

I want more.


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## mandapocalypse

I want to respond to this thread, but I don't even know where to begin.


Basically, YES.
All aspects of survivalism and being self-sustainable are a the peak of my interests. With perhaps a gloomy outlook, yet desire to perhaps live past the 'apocalypse', actively since I was very young with these thoughts I've been trying to learn every possible skill in preparation.

Lately, with a flourishing garden I've been interested in canning and yes, fermentation! 
Herbalism is a knowledge I'm constantly expanding. Modern medicine is unnecessary. Everything we need comes from the earth.

Anarchism, feminism, gender roles, naturalism, environmentalism, TRAVEL.... Rewilding, in both aspects- anarchism & wildlife conservation....

AH ,ALL SO INTERESTING. (and essential to well being!)
Though I have knowledge on these issues I want to know more and will!
More importantly DO more!


You combined a lot of ideas, hassysmacker, ...could easily have conversations for hours and hours on each topic.


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## astreet09

I'm interested in herbalism, feminism and gender roles, permaculture, and more recently I've been trying to get more into the idea of wilderness squatting, learning more primitive skills and connecting anarchism with human rights in general, and tying that into taking better care of myself.

Its what got me to quit smoking, at least.

I still feel like a complete goon when it comes to a lot of these things, aside from feminism and anarchist theory. Any 'required reading' suggestions for permaculture/self sufficiency?


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## hassysmacker

there are so many more than this, but offhand, these are books that come to mind!
-gaias's garden by toby hemenway for a super accessible intro to basic permaculture theory and strategy and application 
-edible forest gardens by dave jacke for a really awesome in depth analysis of how to create ecologically regenerative food producing systems out of perennial plants that mimic the community niches and physical structure of a forest (which are incredibly healthy ecosystems), 
-garden planet by william kotke for a very to the point, concise discussion of the inherent unsustainability of industrial civilization/why it will collapse/why and how permaculture needs to be our answer to sowing the seeds for a new culture that wuill rise out of the ashes, 
-the country living handbook
-when disaster strikes: self sufficiency and preapring for the long emergency
-primitive skills 1 & 2 (i think thats the names) by the society ogf primitive technology
-wild fermnetation by sandor ellix katz


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## pip

Yeah, most of those things interest me. And theres a badass anarchist rewilding/skillshare dealio that takes place yearly called 'wild roots feral futures'(google it)---Its free and absolutely amazing, I went this year and they had food not bombs doing some of the food, and earth first stopped on their way towards oregon with a ton of zines...sidewalk mushrooms are badass..Oh, and we built a super awesome shelter and got wasted in it.


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## shwillyhaaa

pip said:


> Yeah, most of those things interest me. And theres a badass anarchist rewilding/skillshare dealio that takes place yearly called 'wild roots feral futures'(google it)---Its free and absolutely amazing, I went this year and they had food not bombs doing some of the food, and earth first stopped on their way towards oregon with a ton of zines...sidewalk mushrooms are badass..Oh, and we built a super awesome shelter and got wasted in it.


fun!!! im jealous
find me next time


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## tony longshanks

hassysmacker said:


> I'm currently at the Commonweal garden site of the Regenerative Design Institute (Regenerative Design Institute) in Bolinas, CA. Certainly not a radical or punk or anarchist place, but learning tons and that makes it worth it! So I get outta here in a month, and head...elsewhere?



Bolinas. (Pauses, sighs.)


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## sub lumpen filth

Sounds like the shitty strain of anarchism to me. Sry, but fuck primitivist/individualist/drop out anarchism.


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## roughdraft

sub lumpen filth said:


> Sounds like the shitty strain of anarchism to me. Sry, but fuck primitivist/individualist/drop out anarchism.



this isn't reactionary - i seen your post in another thread and you seem pretty smart - so I am really curious about an alternative to the anarchism that you don't agree with, what kind of anarchism would suit you better?


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## sub lumpen filth

Class struggle anarchism. Libertarian Communism/Socialism, Autonomism, Anarcho - syndicalism etc etc etc. Less activisty/drop out of society. More organize your workplace/society. Think May of 68 in Paris. I love traveling and traveling culture, and I love anarchism, but the 2 don't really go together. Neither does being "self-sustainable" (not that its a bad thing - its just not political) The idea is to create a new world WITHIN the shell of the old. Not step outside of society and try to create your own little "anarkie island". I believe "The Revolution" will happen because regular working class people (who dont even consider themselves to be anarchist/socialists) will realize their power and take back the means of production.


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