# Walden III commune/waystation



## joemojave (Apr 18, 2010)

This idea is a spur for the treehouse idea found in another thread. I havent really refined it much yet but I thought that I could use some input anyway. The basic idea is based off of the BF skinner book Walden II. For those who have not read the book, my basic idea is a medium sized commune, maybe about 10 semi permanent residents plus lots of room for visitors. Anyone would be free to visit, as long as they do not break a few basic ground rules (No hard drugs, no theft, etc.) and they were willing to put in a certain number of hours of work for each day they stayed, say 3 hours a day. Most of the work would go toward building new facilities and possibly growing crops. This community could also be freegen depending on its distance from a major town. Anyway, buildings could be built using compressed earth blocks, which are basicly dirt rammed under thousands of lbs pressure to produce a lasting brick. This brick may or may not need to be stuccoed over to keep it from disolving in the rain, depending on the clay content of the dirt and weather or not you add a small percentange of portland cement to the dirt. Compressed earth blocks are made using CINVA rams, which can also make compressed earth roof tiles if portland cement is added or if they are fired later. Foundations could be cement or they could also be compressed earth. FOundations of compressed earth are made by digging a pit and pounding the bottom of it with a tamper until it is hard, then adding and tamping more soil about an inch or so at a time. It is very hard work. Roofs will need to be either framed traditional or framed using steel I beams. Electricity could be supplied using windmills, which can be made by hand using minimal tools. There is a very good book published by an established windmill maker detailing exactly how to do this, step by step. Wind mills do require an inverter to be used with standard electronics, and batteries if you want power at night. Lead acid batteries can possibly be made, but they would probably need to be bought. An inverter could not be made unless sombody happens to be an electrical engineer in the field. Food could be supplied either by gleaning from society or by microfarming, or possibly by bartering food for other goods from local farmers, etc.

I have more ideas about this subject, but I would like other people to give us some input. Also, since this would be a relatively permanent structure, staying on the right side of the law would be important. They would know right where to find us if they wanted to bust us for stealing supplies etc. Also, people would be needed who are willing to donate land, preferably timbered land because then we we have a building supply for roof tiers etc. 

In my mind, this compound should be open to anyone who wanted to live there. This would be great for writers, artists, transients, etc. Howevor, the population should stay low, probably below 20 permanent residents, although if one worked out others could be built in other areas. 

This is still in the infantile idea stage, so if you have any ideas about it please contribute.


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## DCLXVI (Apr 18, 2010)

Sounds great, if it can be organized. Do you really need electricity? Civilization was fine for thousands of years without it.


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## joemojave (Apr 18, 2010)

Electricity is not completely nessisscary (sp?), but it would be usefull, especially to power a freezer, which would be good for storing food. The biggest problem that I see with this is finding a consistant source of food that wont give the cops a chance to clear the place out. Howevor, canning is also a viable way to store most foods, so a freezer is not essential. 

I am thinking about it more, and if we can find a place to build and if other people are down to help, I would definately be able to build a couple CINVA rams, draw plans, and organize the project. I am graduating Highschool in 50 days, after that I will be free to start building if we have a location by then. 

As far as the location goes, the soil type is somewhat important. More than 50 percent clay in unusable for soil cement, and under 30 percent is ideal. Other than that, I would prefer norcal because growing medical marijuana would be a good source of income which could be used to buy food, and beccause I really like norcal. If anybody has any land that we could build this on, speak up. Timbered land with good soil in norcal would be ideal, but most anything with decent soil would work.


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## joemojave (Apr 18, 2010)

new mexico and colorado would also be good places to build because they have relaxed building codes so they would not be up our ass all the time about building with unconventional materials.


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## Pheonix (Apr 18, 2010)

sounds like you've done your research, good for you. I think that's the step most people overlook, I know I did when I bought property to become a farmer thinking I can just stick some seeds in the ground and watch them grow. I might be able to help with the land but out here in the boonies you need transportation to get to town (25 miles) for supplies and further if you want a spanging spot where the cops won't fuck with you. here in central oklahoma the ground underneath the topsoil is probably 50/50 clay and sand with huge chunks of sandstone scattered around. your hay idea from the other post might work good out here too since they grow hay everywhere around here. but if not I'd still like to know more about that windmill since the wind out here is very strong. I was watching the weather channel once and they were counting down the 10 windiest cities in the US and 3 of the top 5 are within 150 miles of me Tulsa,OK, OKC,OK and Dallas/Fort Worth,TX. this small town of 200 that I live in has no building codes and no police (the sheriff is the only one with jurisdiction out here, and highway patrol if your driving)


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## joemojave (Apr 18, 2010)

The wind turbines work fine even durring tornadoes. If the wind hits a certain speed they tilt back which makes them less efficient so that they wont spin to fast and fly apart. As for the soil, try taking a mason jar and filling it 1/3rd with the sandiest/lest clay soil you can find and 1/3rd with water. Shake it until everything is suspended and then let it settle. The sand, clay and silt will seperate and you can get a better idea of how much of each are present. Try and post a picture of the jar after its settled so I can compare it with others I have done. If there is a sand deposit nearby we cannot rule out mixing sand in with the soil along with a low percent of portland cement. 

The only problem I see with this is that OK doesnt have a medical marijuana law yet, which could be a primary source of funding for the project, and the thing about not being nearby to any town. 

Can you give me the name of the closest town so I can get an idea of the area?


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## Pheonix (Apr 18, 2010)

the small town I'm in is Saint Louis the city 25 miles away is Shawnee the OKC metro area is about 50 miles away the marijuanna laws in this state suck dick your first offence of poss. any amount is just a slap on the wrist but the second offence is a felony that carries a max of life in prison. that's why I quit if your just wanting pot for funding purposes I suggest finding another way the choppers also do routine checks in the area, and one rule of thumb about growing marijuanna is never order hydroponics online in your name and have it shipped to your growing area and since I don't grow anything illegal here I have done this and I'll get back to you on the mason jar thing.


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## JohnFNB (Apr 19, 2010)

i have been working on an even smaller scale version of this idea in my town for years it seems. Having people that are constantly around and willing to help is my problem....everyone seems to be super down for like three days then split off and go thier own ways or try and turn it into something different that is unrealistic and rediculous. however my town sucks. if you find a location, i am willing and able to work for this project, and know at least four more dedicated volunteers.


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## LarZ (Apr 19, 2010)

I would love to work on a project like this, but can't quite volunteer myself for the summer, I'd prefer to travel. Late summer though, when it starts to cool down but isn't raining yet would be excellent timing and it could potentially be livable by winter, depending on the workforce.

Firstly, I think the treehouse idea is very picturesque and would be cool but is waay hard and has few benefits, besides not having anything to do with the real point. Community. Even the pressurized brick idea is unnecessarily complicated. No offense. Something worth the read is the Underground House book, which should still be available for download in the downloads section. An underground house would also somewhat limit the ground we dig into, but that's part of building anything.

Besides building, the location would definitely have to be on private land. I'm in northern Cali myself and wandering the woods is not such a great idea. My step-father was actually paid to sit in the woods for 3 months with a big-ass shotgun to guard and tend the plants for his buddy. He apparently shot towards (but never hurt) more than a couple wanderers. Anyways though, NorCal would be a wonderful and fitting location for a successful project like this; its got my vote. The home-grown medicine would likewise be a good source of income, work, and of course bud. Potentially, with a large enough operation, I think it could fund a large portion of the project. 

I'll definitely keep my eyes of this thread.
Larz.


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## joemojave (Apr 19, 2010)

I like the underground home idea for a temporary squat, however I want to build something that is very permanent and imposing if I am working on private land and I dont have to worry about getting run off. In fact, I would like to build something like the LeConte lodge in yosemite (look up pictures). That place is very imposing, it looks huge even though it is actually pretty small. It even looks big when you are inside of it because the roof is very steep and the rafters are exposed, leaving very high ceilings. If we have access to timber at our building lcoation or if we can salvage some big beems somewhere, I would be in favor of building an similar size builing with the same floor plan. 

As for CEB's being overly complicated, I defiantelydisagree. While they are more complicated than digging a hole in the ground and building a roof over it, they lack the problems associated with waterproofing underground houses and they are much more permanent. Depending on the room design, CEB structures can weather damb near any storm. They are much stronger than cinder blocks, while they are also cooler in the summer and warmer in the winter due to there thermal mass and the fact that they breathe. Plus, all you have to do to make a CEB is shovel dirt into the thang and pull the lever. In short, I do not want to build a squat that will be abandoned in 20 years. I want to build a structure that will be around for my grandchildren.

Just to give you a rough idea of the amount of labor that would go into something like a small lodge, lets say you are building a 30x40 main room with one 30x30 room attatched on each side. The walls will be 14 inches thick and stand an average of 10 feet high. To build a place like this, you would need about 1440 bricks that are 12"x6"x3", making no allowance for mortar between the bricks. In a moderate day, a team of 4 or 5 people using only hand tools can make 500 bricks. In other words, it will take about 1 month to make enough bricks for the entire place to have 12" thick walls. If you have another person or two laying the foundation and cutting timbers for the roof, you could have all the bricks layed with the roof up and all the doors and windows framed out within another month. Of course, all of this assumes that you have all the food and supplies you need and you dont have to spend any time gathering provisions. I would guess that with 6-8 people in three months you could have a 3000 square foot house completely built, minus any sinks, toilets, ulitities, etc.


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## Johnny Lightspeed (Apr 20, 2010)

I'm down to donate labor if this works out. Just throwin that out there...


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## joemojave (Apr 21, 2010)

If this works out, I will definately be making seperate thread for bumming materials/labor out of people. Just try to contriubute ideas for now,


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