# Sneaking into burning man this year. FTW



## Deleted member 20

Well its decided after scouring the internet & regional bm forums in search of a last minute ticket I have decided to just bike in by crossing the desert forgoing the normal route & ticket. For your info FTW also stands for "foreva on 2 wheels" as well as "Fuck the world" so both are fitting. Seeing that I don't have the $400 plus for a ticket anyway. My friend whom I drove out to BM last year from NH & Mass respectively are gonna make the trek again. He worked a lot more than me on the fishing boats this year & has been salivating over going all year. He passed out from unknown alcohol/chemicals & or heat exhaustion enough that they were considering a $25,000 airlift via helo last year while the man burned so he purchased his ticket in December, while I was scrounging up xmas gifts for my daughter. I just decided that am going sans ticket about the time I stated writing this thread.

Please be advised as to how much more dangerous this is, compared to just being a stowaway in a vehicle(recommended method). But that being said I am kinda a bad ass mothafucka. I have existed in a constant state of danger for so long it is common place. I am your atypical former USMC 0311 spec ops type. I ride trains, hop borders, do long distance bike treks, traverse mountains, scale buildings, rappel, swim or kayak across rivers, lakes & oceans. I have worked as a bike messenger, high rise window cleaner, ironworker connector & currently work as a commercial fisherman when I am not wandering around.

So I plan to get a ride to Nevada as usual but instead of waiting for 12+ hours in line & paying $400+ for a ticket; I will be evading federal authorities(BLM), state highway patrol, county sheriffs to name a few agencies to have a micro trip inside of my normal 3000 mile road trip (1 way).

I will be painting my Giant Iguana SE up in desert camo colors. I will be carrying my normal US Army assault pack with goretex bivy sack that straps on to the rear rack. I will have a military buttpack attached to the handle bars. I will be wearing my current US Mil digi camo uniform that are actually designed to help defeat nightvision goggles. I will also be making an inexpensive IR cloak/ghillie suit using combat casualty blankets, burlap & camo netting from a kids toy store. I will be adding an extra bottle cage & probably breaking down to buy a camelback. Since nvgs are my main concern, my heat signature will be my main concern while traveling at night; but I will also travel during the day. I plan to treat this as another high risk mission & be completely ready to evade authorities. Seeing that I have a natural cop like vibe, am really a former military guy complete with training & jargen & have current issue gear; there is a small chance that I will blend in (think plain sight) if found.

Since cell phones don't work in this area & that I don't have a gps I will be navigating using a topo map & a compass. Since I will be on a bike I will be unable to keep an accurate pace count so I will have to be confident in exactly where I am going. The large illuminated 2nd largest city that pops up every year in Black rock city should be a good beacon but while dehydrated In the desert, anything is possible. Providing sand storms don't conceal the stars I can also use my celestial navigation skills. I will have flares that shoot into the sky in case of emergency. I plan on purchasing a handheld scanner to monitor the airwaves. If it lasts I guess my stubborn ass can start using them while riding trains, lol.

I just got to sneak in then I can blend in. I have illuminated wheel riders for my bike & more appropriate playa wear that will be in my pack. Hopefully I can rendezvous with my buddy & camp with him. He will carry most of my water & food & we will just leave burningman as normal via the approved road.

I am confident in my trade craft that I will probably live to post the completed story on STP without being caught. I am more concerned with finding my buddy amongst the 70k other campers once in BRC. Most communications devices do not work & regular FM GMRS walkie talkies are so common that the airwaves are filled with lots of skip & mumble jumble. Even last year with a map it was hard for me to navigate the playa & was lost for 24 hours & didn't get stressed at all. Since I was home!

To all you snobby, snooty burners who don't support me sneaking in to the Burn, well. fuck off. To all other who think that the million dollar "non commercial" machine that is BM has gotten out of control & is excessively overpriced then we are in agreement.

Unfortunately this is a solo mission. I don't care how many cub scout badges you've earned or how well you play Halo 1,2,3 or 4. Unless you have actually done HALO jumps (High altitude low opening) & have access to a willing aircraft & pilot, don't bother asking to come with me.

So in closing this entire trip will be 6k miles of a normal road trip & only the last 4 miles will be via bicycle. Sure there is a UP line from Gerlach to Winnemuca that also has some BNSF traffic that I could hop with bike & all but trying to think of a reason why this train would stop where I wanted it to is naïve to say the least. The desert aint no joke kiddies.

PS Skydivers are notorious for attempting to sneak into burning man & getting caught, most likely since they are amateurs & opening their shoots way too early & most likely using the pre arranged official LZ.


----------



## Rob Nothing




----------



## Dmac

Best of luck! take lots of pics.


----------



## Tude

Dood - you rock!


----------



## Deleted member 20

My cellphone/smart phone is constantly letting me down. It almost always dies when I most need it or is completely dead during photo ops. Most times when I am lucky enough to have a charge I will be trying to trace a car & the fucking csx computer cant understand my boston accent or the slack/brake noise of the train distorts what I say. I am constanly using it for google maps & other shit & charging it is a priority alongside water, shelter & food; but it often lets me down.

I will try to to take pics as always even tho I am bad at sharing them outside of instagram. The process is easier for me to do from that same phone. With my tapatalk app Its hard enough for me to read posts & comment.


----------



## Traveler

Why is it hard to sneak into burning man?


----------



## Deleted member 20

I don't necessarily know if it is or aint. I haven't snuck in yet. I do know that federal, state, tribal, local police & volunteer BM rangers are all trying to prevent people from sneaking in. I approach most of my endeavors with this type of precise planning & educational phase, followed by an on site recon to evade detection. I know its probably easier for me to sneak inside someones vehicle but that would require me to convince another person to undergo risk & punishment. I tackle real world problems alone anyway. I guess I like to test myself against opposition forces that are actively attempting to prevent me from going somewhere. Its also rewarding to gain access to secure sites undetected. Especially in the harsh environment of the high desert with little natural cover & only my wits, training & luck to avoid detection by the best military equipment & trained leo's.


----------



## pigpen

why on earth would there be a multi agency effort to keep people from sneaking into burning man? I cant imagine the feds or state cops really caring enough to patrol the perimeter day and night. what's the worst they could really do if they caught you trying to sneak in, it's not like burning man requires special security clearance or anything, it's a big private party in the desert.


----------



## Deleted member 20

Well its the second largest city in Nevada for a lil over a week. 70,000 people become this largest tempotrary intentional community. The permit from BM allows a specific amount of people to play out on the playa.

Its on the Bureau of land Management land & having attended can speak to the amount of leos patrolling. There are undercover agents/rangers partying alongside burners, all the while building cases to make arrests. Public sex, illegal drugs & fireworks are still "illegal". That is primarily inside the event. However there are patrols in trucks, atvs, on foot etc & lookout stations. Since there is a trash fence that is the perimeter of the absolutely massive event (square miles), any travel outseide the fence are trespassers. The BLM rangers routinely drive well over 100mph in their 4x4s to apprehend people or save them if they have gone off the reservation while tripping balls on their chosen halucinogen.

I wish I was making this up, lol. This isn't sneaking into your local warped tour to see Green day or what ever bitch ass bands plays there now. There are people that physically search your vehicle for people, dogs to search for drugs. The real risk is whom ever is driving the vehicle you get caught in has to return you back to the nearest town. A day long drive round trip with traffic from the mass of attendees trying to get close while only allowed to drive 25 mph & waiting in insane 12+ hour lines.

This is just my chosen method. I have successfully trespassed for many years without a single sitation or arrest. On occasion I have just had honest conversations as to who I am & what I am doing & have had my name taken in a notebook of a cop that goes no further than that. I do all my own reconnaissance & find my own way in. I do not rely on crewchange guides to hop trains. I don't need no wet behind the ears road dawg to hold my hand. Its just me & this is how I roll.I go out & get shit done, & don't get killed or caught! I don't have a ticket but that wont stop me.


----------



## Matt Derrick

normally, i would dissuade anyone making these kinds of plans, but from the sound of it you have everything planned out and are prepared in a big bad way that i don't see from most travelers, which is unfortunate, since there's a lot of epic things like this we could all be doing with just a little bit of balls and some pre-planning.

i salute you sir, and i think your plans are incredibly bad ass. i know you just have your phone, but if you could maybe take notes and write a story for us afterwards, i would be eternally grateful, as i am actually quite excited to hear how this turns out. i mean, this could be one hell of an epic story. i don't know what else to say besides good luck and may the force be with you


----------



## Cardboard

They are pretty crazy about stopping people getting in. My housemates went on a mission in 2006 to sneak in, 4 out of 5 were caught, and issued 1500$ fines for being within 75 feet of the perimeter. They took them inside to issue the fines, at which point, friends of ours who were BRCC organizers laughed their asses off at the guys, and gave them free entry (still the criminal tresspass charges and $1500 fines though). These guys were also all taking it really serious, weeks of planning, scouting, and having good supplies specifically for sneaking in.
The one guy who made it in, no problems, not a single question asked, just took off all of his clothes, put a blanket over his head, and walked through the main gates, acting like he was totally fucked on drugs.


----------



## Deleted member 20

\Well perhaps I will be imploring combined multiple tactics as some of your housemates. I hate to sound elitist but I have to believe that my extensive USMC training, real world application of that training, current generation personal equipment and honing of my tradecraft/fieldcraft over 20 years should give me an edge. It would be easier to say that I am more likely to succeed compared to an untrained group of stoners sitting around a kitchen table because I know that would be ignorant of me to say. Problem is that I don't know the background of any of your friends that tried. I have been working on this since forking over the $380 last year for a ticket.

I would like to think that the naked successful guy had a phd in pysch for his genius but more likely just a huge set of balls. I will be using terrain, known landmarks, camo & concealment, shift changes & will utilize tradecraft to adjust my appearance once over the trash fence. The knowledge of electronic optics & how/when they work I hope gives me an edge.

I have a weeks worth of time to get caught, processed rehydrated & keep attempting it. Since I will be collecting intel on every recon attempt I will be able to use that intel the next time. Ideally I can adjust on the fly to compensate in security/patrol patterns that I see. As far as the $1,500 fine; they cant get blood from a stone. I already over over $100k to the US govt not including a lifes worth of income taxes (figure another $300k+). Ideally my audacity will prove over the top enough to succeed.

I hope to be a a dusty phoenix rising up out of the desert in a place that no human would dare sneaking in from!

Since I am actually leaving on the road trip today I cant give any more operational clues until after the mission. Since this is a public forum their is a chance that someone here actually volunteers for G, P & E or knows someone who does. Since I want to volunteer for the "P" in G,"P" & E next year I don't mind making a name for myself but also don't want to not be accepted into there cadre. I'm not really worried about authorities searching the net for stuff since all they got to do is patiently wait in their air conditioned vehicles to see something out of place.


----------



## Matt Derrick

personally, i can't wait to hear back on how this goes. i watched a documentary a while back on current tv about burning man, and they had a segment on the security there. one guy had some night vision goggles... i seriously doubt they were 3rd gen 'actual' nightvision googles (the shit the army uses is expensive as fuck, as im sure you know). but that guy kinda seemed like a tool/wannabe cop in the doc anyways. just pointing it out. it's not like they got swat with military gear or anything, but you never know, there might be that one over zealous guy. so my point is to be careful (which you already are)


----------



## Deleted member 20

My fear goes past nir optics & nvgs even current gen mil. My fear is flir & even worse radar. Flir has its vulnetability but radar(like on a boat can sweep huge areas of a target area like 50 miles & avail to public for less then flir.


----------



## Deleted member 20

Just got wheels up from Mass. The journey begins.


----------



## Cree

Nothing but "good vibes" for you on this trek!!!


----------



## Deleted member 20

Well i thought i was wheels up from Mass. Turns out i crashed on my wifes grandmas couch waiting for my friend. His procrastination on routine vehicle maintenance has turned into a potential disaster. He spent the night trying to vix the VW only to find another problem. We are delaued hundreds of miles & 16hours so far from the scheduled safe departure time. With black rock city 3k miles away & a specific time the gate opens not to mentiom the needed supplies we need to get in reno, traffic of 60k people on 1 entry road & the unforseen travel delays. We are now far behind the 8 ball.


----------



## Cardboard

Hmmm, I would guess that your training does indeed go farther, but would also guess that with all of the connections we have to the BRCC, that they knew better what they were up against, and may have had a tactical advantage. The guy with the blanket is a crazy guy, but a psych major, not quite. I bet tons of people who are on this site are wearing patches he made though. These people were well experienced travelers, some of the original AMF organizers, People with a lot of years of touring/organizing with many festivals, and had a good idea what they were doing.

However, that said, I meant no criticism towards your plan, just thought I would share the story. I still crack up thinking about this shit till this day. Everyone coming back pissed off and having to go to court, except the one crazy guy who put in the least effort, came back after having a great time, and had made loads of money selling patches in the mean time...


----------



## Deleted member 20

Its all good. I appreciated the story to put things in perspective to us at stp who routinely squat, trespass, sneak in places to explore daily. My military training & many years as an experienced budget traveler cant seem to get my ass out of my own damn neighborhood, so its all humbling. I am still eaiting on my buddy & roadtrip partner to macgyver his vdub back into action. All dressed up & no where to go!!!. Most Boston & New england peeps driving out have already left. Unsure if the mass en


----------



## Dameon

If you have a smart phone, you have a GPS, regardless of normal cell service. If it's Android, I know there's several free apps on the play store. Other types of smart phones probably have similar free apps.

Have you considered taking all the effort and resources you're putting into this and just putting them into going into the wilderness with a few friends and having your own party? Probably be a lot more fun and higher odds of success.


----------



## Deleted member 20

Well seeing that i have very few friends that sounds like me most of the time. I like the communal atmosphere & energy of the event. I dont drink or do drugs anymore so that part of this event isnt for me.

I likecl the idea of a gps regardless of cell service but refuse to rely on electronics for navigation. Id rather have a topgraphical map & compass (i know there aint much elevation changes & landmarks in the desert but ifvi keep a running pace count I can navigate just as well)compass


----------



## Deleted member 20

Well seeing that i have very few friends that sounds like me most of the time. I like the communal atmosphere & energy of the event. I dont drink or do drugs anymore so that part of this event isnt for me.

I likecl the idea of a gps regardless of cell service but refuse to rely on electronics for navigation. I do use google maps for urban nav often or for satelite views of railyards but any experienced traveler will probably agree that when you most need a device the battery will be dead. Id rather have a topgraphical map & compass (i know there aint much elevation changes & landmarks in the desert but ifvi keep a running pace count I can navigate without relying on electricity. Please dont recomend a solar charger, ive tried em & they are shit.

I will still be actively searching cl for a face value ticket but have this as the backup plan. Often my backup plans have way more pre planning than plan A. Then plan B that is always less desirable comes into play & theb plans C thru Z are just a jumble of luck & trial & error. "I plan my dive & dive my plan" whenever possible. 

Perhaps we can arrange a party om a huge floating iceberg?


----------



## Kim Chee

No shortage of confidence in this thread.


----------



## Weston

U got this. Free Burning Man FTW (For the Win)


----------



## Rhudey

Bad ass, I hope this works(ed) for you, please update us after BM! I have been thinking about doing the same thing for a while but I'm not as cool as you lol


----------



## Deleted member 20

Well i just ate an indian taco after the burn. It was a successfull failure. I was gifted a ticket so didnt have to sneak in. I left before the man burn to beat the traffic back to san fran. Gonna be heading to sf then la & dipping my piggy toes in the pacific somewhere along the way to santa fe then back to mass.


----------



## Matt Derrick

highwayman said:


> Well i just ate an indian taco after the burn. It was a successfull failure. I was gifted a ticket so didnt have to sneak in. I left before the man burn to beat the traffic back to san fran. Gonna be heading to sf then la & dipping my piggy toes in the pacific somewhere along the way to santa fe then back to mass.



what's an indian taco?


----------



## Deleted member 20

Exactly. A lot of the area around BRC is on reservation land & they have popup type tents & services that cater to burners. Everything from selling trinkets, ice, water,bikes & gas to recycling bikes/coolers to sell back to burners next year. Indian tacos are like Mexican but served on fryebread.


----------



## spectacular

ftw also stands "for the win"


----------



## OutsideYourWorld

Well that was anti-climatic


----------



## Ready4theWorld

I tried sneaking in last year... I gave my word to these guys that I would stick with them until we got caught or got in.... I regretted that very soon. I should have jumped out of the truck when we were on a hill outside the playa and walked across... But I don't like breaking my word and I was cool with these guys.. Any who, we got caught and got a $125 ticket..


----------



## Deleted member 20

I got in by using psychological warfare & positive mental attitude. Luck played a huge roll though. Even if I was approaching the perimeter on my belly this last year. The rare window of that huge rain storm would have allowed me a window to get in undetected but it would have been impossible to predict & only allow minutes to capitalize on by speed walking during the storm.


----------



## Kim Chee

Matt Derrick said:


> what's an indian taco?


It is a lot like a Korean taco only Indian


----------



## Odin

Why isn't there a Hilarious Emote...? mmmmmmmichael needs a hilarious emote... funny is not enough. ::cigar::


----------



## Blu

@highwayman

You posted at the beginning of this thread about keeping up to date on your Instagram. Would you be willing to share your username on here or PM? I have a decent number of traveling friends on there and would love to see your adventures on my feed. I searched highwayman a minute ago and none of the profiles listed came up with anything remotely travel related, which I find funny.


----------



## Deleted member 20

@Blu I am @trustedservanthood on IG. My ig is a bit of everything in my life, some traveling, some fishing, some churches, some biking, lots of concert stuff, family pics etc. I am unsure if there is much in & around this last years trip to the playa or anything of interest to anyone (my phone did get fried by using a solar charger that was reflecting off a mylar coated hexayurt). I still cant believe that up until it got ruined I was receiving calls in my tent out by 7 & k. It felt like an episode from he twylight zone.


----------



## Ready4theWorld

highwayman said:


> I got in by using psychological warfare & positive mental attitude. Luck played a huge roll though. Even if I was approaching the perimeter on my belly this last year. The rare window of that huge rain storm would have allowed me a window to get in undetected but it would have been impossible to predict & only allow minutes to capitalize on by speed walking during the storm.


Yeah.. 

I was thinking of trying again, but I got A ride to the town A little outside it. Like the first one you come up on with all the masks. I just ended up getting drunk and hanging with those folks. I wish I tried again... I got to see BM at night on a huge hill next to the playa, which was super bad ass. Ya win some, ya lose some. 

Edit- And I tried for about 20 hours to get a ticket. Was running up and down the line of cars dancing and screaming "ONE TICKET! JUST ONE! IT'S ALL I NEED!"


----------



## Deleted member 20

I didnt try to get a ticket, the universe just provided one free after couchsurfing with fellow burners in Chicago. PMA, Luck & Timing is all.


----------



## cookieoh

A valiant effort. Love your posts/advice so I followed you on insta. I'm @niggers


----------



## Deleted member 20

cookieoh said:


> A valiant effort. Love your posts/advice so I followed you on insta. I'm @niggers



Thanks for the IG support & since you appreciate my posts/advice than I will say that @niggers is a terrible username. I dont care if you are black, from the country of Niger or a card carrying member of the KKK or some other wingnut neonazi; theres no reason to bring that much negative attention on to yourself by using that user name.

I noticed that user name on ig this morning & wasnt gonna follow you back because of the name. Why did you choose that username on IG or anywhere? You do know that you can change your username on instagram as you mature. I have done it myself, I once was @some_call_me_mayhem & was known in real life as mayhem when drinking/drugging etc & now I am now @trustedservanthood (a name that combines my service to others & that I am a hoodlum aspiring to be better).


----------



## cookieoh

It's my sense of humor. I'm not racist and never say racist or hateful things on insta, which is why I haven't been banned.

It's pretty funny putting my normal white life up on ig with the name *******. I get quite a bit of enjoyment from it and find it hilarious, and so does everyone else who follows me. People take social media waaay too seriously.

Besides being a joke, I also like it because it exemplifies my beliefs about freedom of speech. My black friends who know me think it's funny, and they say anyone who's bothered by it is a sensitive pussy, and I agree. I know there will come a day when I get into a fist fight about it, but honestly I'm so down to fight for what I believe in. Who are you to tell me what words in the English language are acceptable to use? ******* means ignorant person. A ****** can be any race. I think it's bullshit that white people are "not allowed" to use that word. That in itself it racist and I believe in equality for all.

It's almost ironic. Only ******* get offended by the word *******. I love it. I grew up in North Florida and I know way more white ******* than black ones. Hate speech and racism isn't cool, and I don't hate anyone. In fact I rarely even say the word out loud, but I like that I can. True racism will die with the older generation. Us young people hardly know the real segregation and racism that our parents and grandparents lived through. ******* is a word and I will exercise my right to use it until the day I die. Fuck political correctness, fuck double standards, and fuck all these sensitive people who try to tell me what I can do or say.

You may not get it, you may think it's dumb, or you may think I'm a piece of shit... But honestly the freedom to make my own mistakes Is something I'm truly grateful for.


----------



## Deleted member 20

I had a similar debate with a homosexual whos a member of STP & was trying to remove the sting of certain words by using them openly on STP. The thing about it is that STP isnt a free for all for any individual to use hate speech or homophobic speech freely to accomplish some sort of attack on the power reserved for certain words. I am not overly sensitive at all & am pretty aggressive in everything I do. I grew up in the inner city of Boston & was 1 of 12 white students among 950 in my high school. I grew up in the hotbed of race riots due to forced bussing. The issues of poverty, addiction, violence & gangs exist past color lines & were/are an everyday struggle for many. What is a "white life"???? I dont think anyone should use the word on STP!


----------



## Deleted member 20

I did follow you on instagram before your explanation & dont know you or your sense of humor but figured WTF is there to loose?. It is my online social media that I participate with. I am active on this forum but these two are the extent of my online interactions.


----------



## cookieoh

Hahaha yeah. By white life I just mean a generic personal instagram account. Not a theme account or anything to do with '*******' at all.

We've gotten pretty off topic, if your ever in the Denver area hit me up I'll buy you a beer and a sandwich!


----------



## Matt Derrick

cookieoh said:


> It's my sense of humor. I'm not racist and never say racist or hateful things on insta, which is why I haven't been banned.
> 
> It's pretty funny putting my normal white life up on ig with the name *******. I get quite a bit of enjoyment from it and find it hilarious, and so does everyone else who follows me. People take social media waaay too seriously.
> 
> Besides being a joke, I also like it because it exemplifies my beliefs about freedom of speech. My black friends who know me think it's funny, and they say anyone who's bothered by it is a sensitive pussy, and I agree. I know there will come a day when I get into a fist fight about it, but honestly I'm so down to fight for what I believe in. Who are you to tell me what words in the English language are acceptable to use? ******* means ignorant person. A ****** can be any race. I think it's bullshit that white people are "not allowed" to use that word. That in itself it racist and I believe in equality for all.
> 
> It's almost ironic. Only ******* get offended by the word *******. I love it. I grew up in North Florida and I know way more white ******* than black ones. Hate speech and racism isn't cool, and I don't hate anyone. In fact I rarely even say the word out loud, but I like that I can. True racism will die with the older generation. Us young people hardly know the real segregation and racism that our parents and grandparents lived through. ******* is a word and I will exercise my right to use it until the day I die. Fuck political correctness, fuck double standards, and fuck all these sensitive people who try to tell me what I can do or say.
> 
> You may not get it, you may think it's dumb, or you may think I'm a piece of shit... But honestly the freedom to make my own mistakes Is something I'm truly grateful for.



all this says to me is that you're really ignorant/insensitive to the plight of people of color. whether the word has meaning for _you _or not is irrelevant. It has a very deep and painful meaning for folks that have had to deal with that kind of hate and discrimination their whole lives, where _you _have not. try opening up your point of view a little and you might realize that just because YOU don't have a problem with something (aka someone who's never dealt with oppression due to white privilege) doesn't mean it doesn't have a completely different meaning for someone else.

and frankly, i DARE you to say that to a random black person on the street. sorry, your friends don't count.


----------



## cookieoh

Why would you dare me to say that, you think I just run around and try to offend people? No. I sometimes do tell 'random' black people that I've just met about my instagram name and some get angry, But it's MY NAME. Which has zero to do with anyone's plight. And you say what the word means to me is irrelevant? No. What the word means to every single person is relevant. If I had it my way all racial connotation attached to the word would be abolished. And to indicate I'm insensitive and ignorant to the plight of black people, are you serious? A simple word should have absolutely nothing to do with oppression. Maybe you should open up your own point of view a little bit and realize that accepting the status quo of the word as 'racist' is oppressive in of itself, which furthers 'the plight of black people'. If I could snap my fingers and take all the hateful weight that word carries, our world would be one step closer to destroying racism as a whole. It would remove a valuable tool from the haters toolkit- so to speak. 

I understand as a forum admin and website owner that probating me and disagreeing is the safest move to make, and you're right. It pisses people off.

With that said, I never said anything hateful or racist. By making a 7 letter word automatically racist is wrong. By you making it a big deal, I believe- (and this is up for debate) that you are empowering racism by propitiating and validating it as a whole. 

Racism is a man made construct. As long as man accepts it and recognizes it- it will never truly go away. 

this "*******" issue is just a tiny brick in the giant wall of racism/oppression. By taking away the words racist meaning it weakens the wall ever so slightly. Call me optimistic, but I think real racism can easily dissappear in as little as a few generations. I can't predict the future but I can _hope_ for the future. 

So go ahead and give me my warning or whatever. I do love this forum and it's wealth of information and you've made a great thing here Matt. We can agree to disagree and I won't say the word here anymore.


----------



## Deleted member 2626

Gonna back this guy on the subject of free speech. But also I don't go around saying either fag or the word nigger but friends call each other that joking around a lot. Its ironic especially if your not racist in the least bit( me). Me and my friends will call each other names making fun of the people that actually do it to each other. My few friends and me don't call each other names for some initiation or weird male awkwardness. They are just words someone put emphasis behind and tagged them racial. Read about the old mountain men. "This her' mountin nigger had some plumb fine doin's last moon." Something like that


----------



## wizehop

Saying things within a group of friends and using negative words in a public space where said groups congregate are two very different things. There is zero reason for any of those words on here, zero.


----------



## Kim Chee

Off topic non-productive conversation. Thread locked.


----------

