# Indigo/Crystal/Rainbow Children, The New Age Movement, Healing Crystals, etc.



## Toasty Tramp (Jul 25, 2015)

I need some assistance.
I know OF these topics, but don't KNOW...well, anything else, really.

I'm desperately trying to track down credible information and figure this shit out. I'd be more than happy to read a book or 10, if I knew which ones to dive into. I DO know that these Children are human bodies with extraterrestrial spirits that were sent to unfuck Mankind. I know Indigo Children were supposed to be the first, beginning to appear somewhere in like the 60's through the 80's. Rainbow Children throughout the 90's, and Rainbow Children ever since. I know the groups have their own distinct purpose.

I know a lot of people have turned their trust into the healing power of various crystals, but I couldn't tell ya why or if it works. I'd love to report from first hand experience, but I have none.

I know a lot of people believe in the idea that we're all intrinsically connected on the spiritual level...But I couldn't tell ya where the idea originates, and what the *rest *of the idea says (I'm sure there's more to it.)

I dunno where the hell to begin 
*HELP.*


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## Kim Chee (Jul 25, 2015)

I'm not sure if any spirits are terrestrial.

We're here and then we're there (I think).

I'm assuming spirits (souls) are unencumbered by physical constraints.


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## Odin (Jul 25, 2015)

Milktoast said:


> I know a lot of people believe in the idea that we're all intrinsically connected on the spiritual level...But I couldn't tell ya where the idea originates, and what the *rest *of the idea says (I'm sure there's more to it.)




I don't know about the rest... crystals and rainbow children. (a search turned up some pages on it... ?? )

Although if you want to explore something on the level of manifestations of your consciousness/spirit, we had an interesting article/discussion a while ago here.

https://squattheplanet.com/threads/...-another-universe-at-death.24337/#post-176122


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## Tude (Jul 25, 2015)

Bunch of conspiracy sites out there that have some info on them about this. Plus Google some wiccan things. I have a couple of books that I have made on this - my shadow books. It is mostly a self discovery kind of thing as I was invited to a coven but did not decide to to that - it was like it was my my next family - um no. I'm a solitary wiccan. And I do hold belief in the individual gemstones as well as herbs. Not sure where you are going with this?


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## Desperado Deluxe (Jul 26, 2015)

The best place to start is with a trip down to your local library or used book store which most, luckily in this day and age have a metaphysical/ new age section usually around the religion or philosophy section (some of which you may be looking for may be found here as well).
Grab a few of the basic shorter books on what your looking for or something that jumps out at you. Many of the books you will read will have references to further your reading.
There are books that take a general approach to these subjects and there are ones that focus on specific subjects. As with any other subject the more you learn about it the more you will form your own idea of what its all about by comparing information.
Also depends on what your aim is in this subject as it is very broad. (Are you trying to learn about the indigo children themselves, about the metaphysical properties of gems, or the general subjects associated with these things?)
A good book that I have learned a lot from is tao te ching by lao tzu which teaches about the properties of yin and yang. It is a fairly common book probably located in the philosophy section. I've used what I've learned from this book into practise in multiple parts of my life.
Hope this helps.


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## Toasty Tramp (Jul 26, 2015)

I'm not sure, either, to be honest. I know absolutely nothing about Wicca, and I'm looking for a good place to change that. The problem I'm having is that we're in the age of the internet, where most of man's knowledge has been collected and indexed and available with a few taps of your fingers.
I honestly just dunno where the fuck to even begin ::
What I posted is pretty much what I'm aware of on the matter...I dunno, I've managed to make it 25 years before ever coming into contact with Wicca. It has my curiosity


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## Desperado Deluxe (Jul 26, 2015)

What got you interested in this subject?


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## iflewoverthecuckoosnest (Jul 26, 2015)

Wicca and the whole rainbow/crystal children movement definitely aren't one and the same. But, as a very curious person, I can point you to some good resources to learn about wicca/neopaganism from. I'm not a dedicated neopagan or witch, however I have found the movements fascinating enough to garner a bit of a library surrounding them  I've also dabbled here and there. 

Some good books to start with;
A Witches' Bible, by Stewart Farrar - This is a rather detailed volume that describes the Sabbats and seasonal rituals performed in traditional Wiccan covens. It is not based around solitary practice, as most of the rituals require any number of people. 
Drawing Down the Moon, by Margot Adler - This more of a sociological course surrounding Neopaganism and witch craft writ large. Far more general and focused on the culture of the religions rather than the specific rituals of them. This book can also point you in the direction of many other books surrounding the subject. 
Wicca; a Guide for the Solitary Practitioner, and its companion volume, Living Wicca, by Scott Cunningham- These are beginner's guides to the ethics of solitary Wicca. They also contains instructions on some basic rituals, and various symbols that one can use in his/her own spells. 

You can easily get these books used online, or, like others said, step into a used book shop. You can find some damn interesting books on paganism, witch craft, and related religions just wasting away in the shadows of a dusty book shelf, sometimes.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Jul 26, 2015)

I was told, long ago, that I am definitely an Indigo child.

I have a friend who is VERY knowledgeable on this very subject.

Private message me and I'll see what I can do for you.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Jul 26, 2015)

Oh and as a sideline, her info will be strictly about the Rainbow and Indigo children.

I don't think she knows anything about Wicca.

If you're looking for a path to study, I'd suggest Taoism or Hinduism.

Both, are absolutely fascinating...

Peace!


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## Brother X (Jul 26, 2015)

Drawing Down the Moon, as has been mentioned is a great place to start. Also, a practical knowledge of Shamanism is a good foundation. I recommend Graham Hancock's book, Supernatural. A great intro and from there you can branch out into the more in depth stuff (like Eliade) if it piques your interest.


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## EphemeralStick (Jul 26, 2015)

Milktoast said:


> I'm not sure, either, to be honest. I know absolutely nothing about Wicca, and I'm looking for a good place to change that. The problem I'm having is that we're in the age of the internet, where most of man's knowledge has been collected and indexed and available with a few taps of your fingers.
> I honestly just dunno where the fuck to even begin ::
> What I posted is pretty much what I'm aware of on the matter...I dunno, I've managed to make it 25 years before ever coming into contact with Wicca. It has my curiosity



Read the Green Witchcraft series by Ann Moura to learn more about Wicca. It's very informative and unlike other books it doesn't pay into Hollywood-esque sensationalism. Also Scott Cunningham has a collection of encyclopedias covering stones, herbs, and terms. He is another one that is information based rather than gimmick based. 

Avoid authors like Silver Ravenwolf or any book that has "spells" in it and tries to sell you on generic spells. Typically these authors just play into teenage curiosity and a fantastical idea of what Wicca is.


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## Kim Chee (Jul 26, 2015)

While I was living ouside spent much time in the "general knowwledge" section of the library. I'm not sure why these things are considered general knowledge by the library though.

More information can be found here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Age 

Yes, they have fallen into the new age category despite the possibility that they may be older than new.

Library non-fiction is divided into sections (the things you are inquiring about start at 100):

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Dewey_Decimal_classes


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## Toasty Tramp (Jul 26, 2015)

Fox Spirit said:


> What got you interested in this subject?



I've been searching for answers to questions I don't even know for some time, and the quest has simply taken an interesting turn in this direction. I've learned to not question a certain kinda intuitive feeling that I get from time to time, and this is one of those times. I'm a curious soul, and I just came into _tons _of free time that I gotta put to use 



Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> I was told, long ago, that I am definitely an Indigo child.
> 
> I have a friend who is VERY knowledgeable on this very subject.
> 
> Private message me and I'll see what I can do for you.



You got it  Fuckin' _awesome. _I've heard the same, a couple of times. I don't have the first idea what it _really _means to be an Indigo/Rainbow/Crystal Child, I've only brushed across the topic in passing. Got the day off, so I'll probably bounce in and out of workin' underneath StP's hood and reading about it  



EphemeralStick said:


> Avoid authors like Silver Ravenwolf or any book that has "spells" in it and tries to sell you on generic spells. Typically these authors just play into teenage curiosity and a fantastical idea of what Wicca is.



Thanks for the heads up -- I'd have never known to make the distinction! You probably just saved me a couple of months of hangin' out in the 100's section <3 I'd have just devoured everything they have hahaha.


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## EphemeralStick (Jul 26, 2015)

The issue with Silver is that she plays into a fantasy that all Wiccans sit around casting spells to make people love them or spells to meet a celebrity. I'm not even joking, she has a "meet a celebrity" spell. There is most definitely a distinction between the Hollywood witch and someone who actually studies the craft.

Most practicing Wiccans will tell you that we don't sit around summoning demons or casting love spells or any nonsense like that. It's about connecting to world around you on a spiritual level that is different for each person. Anyone who tries to sell you their beliefs as truths shouldn't be taken seriously. We draw knowledge from various sources and blend them in ways that make sense to us. Taking up the craft is a personal journey, one that is unique to the individual. Send me a PM if you ever want to talk Magic from a philosophy stand point.


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## Deleted member 125 (Jul 26, 2015)

im not trying to be rude or judgemental but are you serious? you think yer part et part human? this kind of cult hive mind stuff really irks me, especially when brought up in a community like this. isnt this what most people think we (and i use that term super fucking broadly) think we are? a buncha weirdos with tin foil hats. unfortunetly for myself maybe i just want believe in stuff like that or put my trust into it because its just not tangible to me. again i sincerly dont mean to sound rude or jaded i just think the whole thing is a bullshit copout to dealing with reality.


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## Toasty Tramp (Jul 26, 2015)

I'm sorry that another person's quest for a way to make sense of the world causes you so much distress =/
And I'm not full of bullshit. Its ignorance on the topic that I'm full of, alongside an insatiable desire to cure myself of it. Who knows? I'm probably _completely _fucking up what the stuff is actually about. I know absolute shit about all of this, so the chances are _pretty fucking high_...But what I DO know is there's certainly something amiss in the world, and I'd like to figure out what that is. I wish I could tell ya what it was, and what we could do about it, but I'm just as clueless as the next fuckin guy. I'm desperate for answers, and I won't shy away from places that provide even the _smallest_ opportunity to uncover answers to some of the questions that have been burdening my mind. 
Even if I _do _find myself contemplating whether or not there are people alive today imbued with the spirits of extraterrestrial spirits who were sent by God to guide Earth into some crazy ass shit that I can't even explain.


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## shabti (Jul 27, 2015)

cantcureherpes said:


> im not trying to be rude or judgemental but



and then you happen to come off as both rude and judgemental. How about that?

It's amateur anthropology, (and as a Pagan for many years, I think it's rather stupid that the concept of seeing the world as a divine organism worthy of respect is a concept worthy of tin-foily-hattage.)

and to answer your question Milktoast,
I don't know about the rainbow children thing. I know enough about Wicca to say that it is one (and a very loud and prevalent) denomination of paganism. There are other types of "neo" paganism, like Asatru, Satanism, etc, that borrow from the ceremonial magician lodge type stuff that evolved out of the late 1800's enlightenment period. Now there's chaos magick, sumerian practicioners, brujeria, you name it, there's a "Religion" for it.

Within Wicca, there are different flavors, called "Traditions". A. Whole. Freaking. Bunch. Again, to compare it to Christianity, if Wicca is to Paganism as Baptist is to Christian, then Faerie Wicca (or Alexandrian, or NROOGD, etc) is to Wicca as Southern Baptists are to Baptists.

Wicca is one of many hundreds of different Earth centred spiritual paths under the "Neo-Pagan" umbrella that are a loose collection of indigenous belief system recreations, ceremonial magick (think Aleister Crowley), Earth or Gaia consciousness.....hmm. And perhaps ritual practice.

Personally, in all those books people reccomended earlier, I find that the authors give a very specific formula for how to do ritual, how to think about divinity, and how to form community. That's why I don't call myself wiccan. I like doing Yoga, not casting circles. I like _______ not ________. That's not only okay in the pagan community, that's the gift of Wicca to the world at large, in that modern day Pagans are free to borrow and choose what best works for them. It's like the Open Source/Linux of Religions.

a tad of history:

When Gerald Gardner came out publicly after the repeal of the last witchcraft laws in England, people were intrigued, but restricted from joining groups for fear of infiltration coupled with snobbery.

When Raymond Buckland published the Big Book to the public, there was finally information available about how these concepts and practices were used by the witches.

and then, when Scott Cunningham published Wicca: A Guide for the Solitary Practitioner, people were given licence and instruction as to how they could implement these spiritual concepts into their own lives without joining a formal coven structure.

So....yeah. If you look it up, there are probably pagan groups in your area that are open to the public. We love holding pagan pride days, public festivals and spectacles. I urge you to reach out to the community and not just read about us in a book somewhere. 

oh, and many of those books are at the public library.


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## iflewoverthecuckoosnest (Jul 27, 2015)

Brother X said:


> Drawing Down the Moon, as has been mentioned is a great place to start. Also, a practical knowledge of Shamanism is a good foundation. I recommend Graham Hancock's book, Supernatural. A great intro and from there you can branch out into the more in depth stuff (like Eliade) if it piques your interest.



Another good book on Shamanism is The Shaman's Secret; The Lost Resurrection Teachings of the Ancient Maya. Obviously, you're not an ancient mayan, so it's not exactly like this could be an instructional book, so to speak. But it discusses the ancient Mayan views on many of the ideas you've been talking about (death and rebirth, interconnection of all things). I happened upon it about a year ago in a used book store. Really cool shit.
Ditto what @Andrea Van Scoyoc said. Eastern philosophy is totally engrossing and life changing. I bet you'd love it. There's loads of books about it damn near everywhere that you could get started with.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Jul 27, 2015)

shabti said:


> and then you happen to come off as both rude and judgemental. How about that?
> 
> It's amateur anthropology, (and as a Pagan for many years, I think it's rather stupid that the concept of seeing the world as a divine organism worthy of respect is a concept worthy of tin-foily-hattage.)
> 
> ...


Awesome post!

Just one clarification, though...Satanism (LaVey Satanism which is the only real Satanism...other branches/sects, etc having been started by disgruntled former members of the CoS) is in NO WAY, Pagan and to classify it as any form of Paganism, is a serious disservice.

Satanists are atheists, plain and simple. There is no heaven, no hell, no God, no devil and there are no demons, as in the Christian version of history.

The demons, Christians try to scare everyone with, are simply the embodiment of man's repressed animal tendencies...lust, etc.

An actual physical demon, Devils, whatever, don't, never have and never will, exist, except in Christian mythology.

They are the ones who 'need a boogeyman under the bed to keep them in line.' I don't mean that disrespectfully in any way against Christians...none of what I say is meant to be hateful, rude or disrespectful.

I'm simply stating what I've been told first hand (their words) by someone in the know.

Satanists don't. There are laws, The Laws of 9 and the Earth Laws of 11 that teach responsibility and accountability... not, scare tactics.

I am NOT speaking for the CoS, as I am not and never will be a member, but a dear friend of mine is a titled member in high standing and I have educated myself extensively, not only thanks to her, reading The Satanic Bible, but also from the official CoS website, which is packed with information.

Having a Master's Degree in religious studies, Satanism is one of the religions I have an acute interest in.

Again, good post.

Peace!


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## Art101 (Jul 27, 2015)

I enjoy paganism.For me it seems a basic and rational approach to life and everything that entails.I have many pagan friends and enjoy talking with them.For myself I try to be good to people and look at world with wonder every day.


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## Brother X (Jul 27, 2015)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> Satanism (LaVey Satanism which is the only real Satanism



Don't let the O9A hear you say that.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Jul 27, 2015)

Brother X said:


> Don't let the O9A hear you say that. [emoji14]


Oh yeah...people get testy, don't they?

[emoji48]


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## Deleted member 125 (Jul 27, 2015)

its not that it causes me distress, i dont care much either way what yer into. but it makes it hard to have personal respect for somebody when they say they believe in alot of this stuff to me. it just seems like a crutch, needing something to believe in thats pretty out there and lets be honest...this is a big stretch. sure it might be interesting to read about, but to me it would be like picking up a bible because i think its interesting. its just not to me.


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## Brother X (Jul 27, 2015)

^ For me and I can only speak for myself, it comes down to this continuum: Shamanism was the Paleolithic expression, Paganism (Wiccan, Nature and Earth Magicks, et al) is the Neolithic expression of the same thing. A reverence for nature. This reverence can take many forms, but at the end of the day they function as reminders that we are OF nature, not IN it, because "in it" implies separation, like I am IN a pool of water, versus I am OF this pool of water. As we move into a matrix of more and more separation from nature, we need those reminders more and more.

Now, is it "real" or illusion? I feel that is a distinction that does not need to be made. From a scientific point of view, the shamanistic/magickal experience can be equated to any number of scientific theorems. Congress with the spirits can also be expressed as communion with the Jungian Archetypes, prescience as access to the Sheldrakian morphic resonance field, Quantum Entanglement, the list goes on and on. Two languages describing the same causal and acasual effects. 

One of the many things this civilization seems to be suffering from is a denial and/or a dismissal of the liminal in our lives. Again, if the magickal approach isn't your particular language, try some academia in the form of Joseph Campbell or any one of the schools I mentioned above.

Travellers blessing to ye all.


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## Rob Nothing (Jul 27, 2015)

not so much that I dismiss the liminal in my life, but that I'm tired of information about it. and tired of information period. there is too much information, and I my ears have closed themselves my eyes shut my mouth clenched of it's own will.

_"This face is an epilepsy, its wordless tongue gives 
out the unearthly cry,
Its veins down the neck distend, its eyes roll till 
they show nothing but their whites,
Its teeth grit, the palms of the hands are cut by 
the turned-in nails,
The man falls struggling and foaming to the ground 
while he speculates well."_

I opened this thread because I remember hearing vague things about 'crystal children', reading up on it, and discovering that it wasn't for me. 

Do your thing milktoast. You might look up Alex Collier, as I remember him talking a lot about the same stuff.. and other addicionales also. That was all a very long time ago, but you may still find it interesting.


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## iflewoverthecuckoosnest (Jul 28, 2015)

Brother X said:


> Again, if the magickal approach isn't your particular language, try some academia in the form of Joseph Campbell or any one of the schools I mentioned above.
> 
> Travellers blessing to ye all.



Oooh, Joseph Campbell. There's another good one. I can't put his books down.


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## shabti (Jul 31, 2015)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> Awesome post!
> 
> Just one clarification, though...Satanism (LaVey Satanism which is the only real Satanism...other branches/sects, etc having been started by disgruntled former members of the CoS) is in NO WAY, Pagan and to classify it as any form of Paganism, is a serious disservice.



HMMMM... haha. I love discussing satanism. It's intriguing.

The point that other tracts of Satanism that deviate from the Church are somehow "invalid" for their heresy is an interesting idea. Especially since LaVey's own daughter is counted among the number who have branched out. We saw this with the Christian Reformation, those who left were labeled 'false', but held on, and through sheer perseverance managed to form a distinct movement with longevity.

Another reason not to entirely discount splinter groups is that many of them (Think Temple of Set) are most certainly NOT athiest. They are what I would call, 'Luciferian' satansists, who seem to need and want a deity of some kind. Within that community, this is a really critical split! It would be different if they had just formed a C.os look-a-like organization, but they instead redefined the concepts of deity at the core of the belief system! 

I love it.

And yes, the larger pagan community (in an attempt to be more socially acceptable and tolerated) had vociferously distanced themselves from the satanist community. But I'm not really an adequate representative of the 'community at large' , I compare the various groups and find that there is much in common. Rituals taking place in a circle, the calling of a deity (or the psychosemantics that emulate such an act), some of the lodge cermonial stuff, the casting of spells, the requirement to self improvement, (rather than simply "converting" through faith.), for me they are very, very similar animals.

And fascinating conversation topics!


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Jul 31, 2015)

shabti said:


> HMMMM... haha. I love discussing satanism. It's intriguing.
> 
> The point that other tracts of Satanism that deviate from the Church are somehow "invalid" for their heresy is an interesting idea. Especially since LaVey's own daughter is counted among the number who have branched out. We saw this with the Christian Reformation, those who left were labeled 'false', but held on, and through sheer perseverance managed to form a distinct movement with longevity.
> 
> ...


There's no such thing as Luciferian Satanism.

In fact, Luciferians are considered nothing more than the butt of rude jokes, among Satanists...and that's only by the ones who even bother to make note of them.

You can't believe in ANY form of entity (no matter what you call it/them) and call yourself any form of Satanist.

It's simply not possible.

Being as I'm not authorized to speak on behalf of the Church (because I'm not a member, nor their media representative and because honestly, they don't feel the need to defend their beliefs or educate others) I'll do what any member of the Church would do...

Point you to the Church of Satan official website.

I'd suggest spending a good deal of time reading and educating yourself.

I'd also purchase a copy of The Satanic Bible.

Then, if you still have questions, there's a great unofficial Church group on Facebook you can join, okayed by and run by titled CoS members.

Just do your homework before you join.

No tolerance for stupidity is one of the Satanic Laws of Nine and members can be brutal to those they feel haven't done proper homework before coming to them.

I'm a member of the group (you don't have to be an official, card carrying CoS member to join the unofficial group) and have seen new members who think it's funny to say stupid things like, "I'm here to learn because I love Satan," flayed like salmon patties, by members.

Satanism is definitely not for everyone, but it is absolutely fascinating.

As for Zena LaVey...she's some sort of Buddhist now, so you can't use her as a real example.

Ha ha! 

Peace!


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## shabti (Jul 31, 2015)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> There's no such thing as Luciferian Satanism.
> 
> In fact, Luciferians are considered nothing more than the butt of rude jokes, among Satanists...and that's only by the ones who even bother to make note of them.
> 
> You can't believe in ANY form of entity (no matter what you call it/them) and call yourself any form of Satanist.



Why? Because The Church gets to determine what's legit? Because some old dead dude said so? That sounds dangerously close to the thinking Anton built his life rejecting. I've read the Satanic Bible....and the Sabbats for Witches, and even a lot of the Cloven Hoof articles. But the idea that only those satanists who adhere to those ideas are valid is contradictory. If you feel more gratified by having a theistic vision of Satan, (or whatever) then the selfish thing to do is hold your rituals any damn way you please...right?

I reject the idea that the church of satan holds a monopoloy on 'valid' Satanic thought, the same way I reject the idea that the Catholic church holds a monopoly on 'valid' christian thought.

I don't know though. I'm a member of a religion that can't, by definition tell me that I'm not something. As a pagan, there is no central body, no church to tell me that I don't meet the basic requirements for being a pagan. Instead, diversity is celebrated (for the most part).

As an anthropologist (in training, but still) I could never discount a cultural thing. Professionally, I could never say "I understand these people hold deeply to their beliefs, and use them to guide their lives, but those beliefs are stupid because these people over here said so." I could take note of both phenomena, and use them to deepen my understanding of the situation, but not to refute that one observable phenomena is occuring.

In other words, if someone tells me they are a satanist, and that they worship...I dunno, the flying tree frog demon of bal-zak, then it's not my place to correct them. I'll just think to myself

"huh. How about that. there's a bit of satanic thought I haven't heard of before. interesting."
with the assumption that the person holding the beliefs is more of an expert on what is valid about their own religion than I am.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Jul 31, 2015)

shabti said:


> Why? Because The Church gets to determine what's legit? Because some old dead dude said so? That sounds dangerously close to the thinking Anton built his life rejecting. I've read the Satanic Bible....and the Sabbats for Witches, and even a lot of the Cloven Hoof articles. But the idea that only those satanists who adhere to those ideas are valid is contradictory. If you feel more gratified by having a theistic vision of Satan, (or whatever) then the selfish thing to do is hold your rituals any damn way you please...right?
> 
> I reject the idea that the church of satan holds a monopoloy on 'valid' Satanic thought, the same way I reject the idea that the Catholic church holds a monopoly on 'valid' christian thought.


To each their own.

I'm just going by what my best friend (she's more like family and I call her my, 'sister') who is a two decade, titled member has told me.

Being simply a religious scholar (with a Master's in religious studies) I have no dog in any "religious hunt" as it were, as I personally have no use for religion.

I just find it absolutely fascinating.

Anyway... being a part of the unofficial CoS group the way I am (my sister "joined me" to further educate myself, because she knows I'm interested) and having spent hours (literally) bugging her for information, I'm simply relaying what I know to be fact, by those that are actually part of and active in the Church.

I'm done now...

Peace!


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## soodoenim (Aug 1, 2015)

Milktoast said:


> I need some assistance.
> I know OF these topics, but don't KNOW...well, anything else, really.
> 
> I'm desperately trying to track down credible information and figure this shit out. I'd be more than happy to read a book or 10, if I knew which ones to dive into. I DO know that these Children are human bodies with extraterrestrial spirits that were sent to unfuck Mankind. I know Indigo Children were supposed to be the first, beginning to appear somewhere in like the 60's through the 80's. Rainbow Children throughout the 90's, and Rainbow Children ever since. I know the groups have their own distinct purpose.
> ...




My parents were (are?) hippies, and my mother and many of her friends are tapped into these ideas.

First, I would recommend getting a copy of the Celestine Prophecy. I read it when I was fourteen, and I think it's a good introduction to new age spirituality (if I'm gathering your meaning well).

Lately my mom has been talking about the power of pyramids. An interesting book I came across on this subject is Mind Machines You Can Build. My mom has also been trying to get me to watch a short TV series called The Pyramid Code. It apparently offers an alternate and compelling explanation of what the pyramids are, who built them, and what their purpose is.

I've got loads of other stuff to recommend (Ceremony by Leslie Marmon Silko), but let me know if any of this is up your alley, or if you had something else in mind.


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## Princess Nadira (Aug 1, 2015)

I'm definitely an Indigo and in search of the New Age. I want to find my New Age community.


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## Deleted member 125 (Aug 2, 2015)

i cant quote message enough to reply so if anyone is still interested in the thread regarding my thinking you are all full of shit this applies to all, seriously? what happend to no gods no masters? maybe thinking for yerself instead of having to crutch a belief system based on complete bullshit? taking personal responsibility for yer own life and making it yer own? not having to search for a higher purpose because you yerself is good enough and knowing that you are who you are and not BELIEVING that you are some cosmic god damn being. yer a human just like the rest of us. you shit, you eat, you sleep, you die. what you do on yer downtime is yer own choice, its embaressing for me to type this out to grown adults. if you want answers open up a science book. not a science fiction novel, thats entertainment. actually believing is just ridiculous and like i said before...i just cant take anybody seriously who thinks that way. it makes me think serious chemical brain issues.


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## Durp (Aug 4, 2015)

Ok this is quite a wonky thread  first off I will say I am spiritual in my own ways and feel a very real energy exchange which can not be described in words while solitary in nature. And I'm sure that @cantcureherpes will agree modern science is almost its own religion and we know for a fact there are many different spectrums that humans just can not interpret. Think about it like a dog whistle, we can't hear it but dogs freak. I think humans have a very shallow perception of our surrondings and are quite 'blind' in comparison to other sentient beings who do not completely destroy their enviroments (whales for instance). I spent some time with a pagan farm, cool folks but dancing around naked drunk is all cool and all, but does nothing for me spirtually. Honestly it seems sort of like a bunch of older pervy folks trying to get with some fresh young meat from what I saw. Also, most new age stuff is a crock of steaming horse shit. Are you a scientologist next week bro? Haha jk but look into Confucius and different forms of meditation, very healing and powerful stuff. Read a book called Ishmael. My favorite book thus far in life, it will change your thinking.


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## CelticWanderer (Aug 14, 2015)

My aunt is wiccan and uses crystals alot, they can't heal physical ailments but she does use them to remove negative energy from rooms or people that have been afflicted by It. I've started using them cause, like my mom was, I end up having spirits or what have you follow me time to time and i'm really sensitive to energy. uhm, I know a good deal about wiccan shit and i can ask my aunt what i don't know. PM me if you want


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## deleted user (Aug 19, 2015)

Actually pretty surprised and happy nobody tore this kid apart and their are so many pangan/wiccan/earthly spiritual people out there

Anyway I find anthropology on traditional communities to be great sourcs for how spirituality plays into life. Mind you, be weary of anything that romanticizes these cultures, usually tends to be new age bullshit. JimH1991 said pretty much all that needed to be said there and Ishmael is an excellent fucking book. The new age bases alot of its shit on flash cultural opinions, achievements, and pretence while entertaining preset topics to no end in cylindrical logic, probobly because its safe and wont challenge their core belifes. (Also paganism does not equate to new age) Not to say I have not found good info from new agey stuff, because i have, but you probably should avoid garbage like spirit science and the mind unleash; too much unchecked western superiority and its all overlly enticing with all too convenience to their boohicky. That said, be weary of the "new and special" indigo children thing, they run on the same software of any other human being. But most importantly make your own opinions and build your own personal faith, go by your experience.


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## Mankini (Aug 19, 2015)

@Andrea; Please allow me to disagree....I have seen and experienced pure evil out there....Spent alot of time with Navajos and Utes...Please, please read "The Broken Circle"....In 1974, some redneck teens murdered a few Navajo homeless guyz....The court system acquitted the teens, so the Navajos contacted their evil witches. (They have good guyz, who are healers, and bad guys, who are for vengeance and war).....anyways, the evil dudes did evil ceremonies and the Skinwalkers punished the teens horrifically. I do not understand the Dark Side, and I have absolutely NO interest in it: it's real; the Indians know of it; I would prefer to just live in my happy little generic material world. Evil spirits are real; but good ones are equally real. 

As far as religion goes, the Mystics are my great love and passion: The Sufis, Kabbalists; Rosicrucians; all of em. Also Hindu and Christian mystics like Thomas Merton.


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## deleted user (Aug 19, 2015)

voodoochile76 said:


> @Andrea; Please allow me to disagree....I have seen and experienced pure evil out there....Spent alot of time with Navajos and Utes...Please, please read "The Broken Circle"....In 1974, some redneck teens murdered a few Navajo homeless guyz....The court system acquitted the teens, so the Navajos contacted their evil witches. (They have good guyz, who are healers, and bad guys, who are for vengeance and war).....anyways, the evil dudes did evil ceremonies and the Skinwalkers punished the teens horrifically. I do not understand the Dark Side, and I have absolutely NO interest in it: it's real; the Indians know of it; I would prefer to just live in my happy little generic material world. Evil spirits are real; but good ones are equally real. [/QU



You would probably really like almanac of the dead, check that book out!


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## Mankini (Aug 19, 2015)




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## Desperado Deluxe (Aug 28, 2015)

I like these websites so I thought I'd put them up here.

http://alabe.com/freechart/
Good for an astrology reading. Charts everything out for you.

http://facade.com/
This ones good for a quick tarot reading with a choice from different sets of cards. I also like the biorhythms.


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## black (Apr 14, 2017)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> Awesome post!
> 
> Just one clarification, though...Satanism (LaVey Satanism which is the only real Satanism...other branches/sects, etc having been started by disgruntled former members of the CoS) is in NO WAY, Pagan and to classify it as any form of Paganism, is a serious disservice.
> 
> ...



oh, so theistic Luciferians just don't exist, huh? I take a good bit of offense to that seeing as I dedicated a good portion of my life to the Morning Star. I may have converted but that doesn't mean Lucifer is any less a part of who I am or real as a deity to me. Also I would venture to say that you could call Luciferians pagan but that point is certainly debatable given the literal meaning of the word pagan.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Apr 14, 2017)

black said:


> oh, so theistic Luciferians just don't exist, huh? I take a good bit of offense to that seeing as I dedicated a good portion of my life to the Morning Star. I may have converted but that doesn't mean Lucifer is any less a part of who I am or real as a deity to me. Also I would venture to say that you could call Luciferians pagan but that point is certainly debatable given the literal meaning of the word pagan.



I honestly could not care less who or what you worship.

If you'd bothered to read my previous posts/responses, you'd have very plainly seen where I very plainly stated that I have no use for religion and have no dog in any type of religious discussion, opinion etc, etc, so, save your indignation for someone who cares.

I was simply imparting the information I've been given by those in the CoS in the know.

As for being offended...Really? What would make you think I care?

If you can't participate in adult discussions on this website, without getting asshurt, you won't last.

Now...Ta ta, farewell, fuck off or whatever else it is you plan to do.

I'm not here to argue or be argued with.


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## black (Apr 14, 2017)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> I honestly could not care less who or what you worship.
> 
> If you'd bothered to read my previous posts/responses, you'd have very plainly seen where I very plainly stated that I have no use for religion and have no dog in any type of religious discussion, opinion etc, etc, so, save your indignation for someone who cares.
> 
> ...



wow. whats all that about adult discussions? is it adult to immediately respond with defensive banter when I simply gave an opinion? being an adult doesn't mean I have to stay silent when someone says something ignorant. its not about me being offended, its about your claims. I would say being an "activist"(in terms of having some stake in the plight of other beings/exterior entity or believing in a cause higher than the self, inferring that you experience empathy as an emotion in some capacity) and someone who claims to have a Masters in religious studies would mean that I could open up a sincere conversation about a branch of a certain religion that you seem to be relatively uninformed of, or at the very least apathetic to. you obviously care, seeing as how your response was pretty emotional, as was mine. but that's okay. "do as thou wilt"


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Apr 14, 2017)

black said:


> wow. whats all that about adult discussions? is it adult to immediately respond with defensive banter when I simply gave an opinion? being an adult doesn't mean I have to stay silent when someone says something ignorant. its not about me being offended, its about your claims. I would say being an "activist"(in terms of having some stake in the plight of other beings/exterior entity or believing in a cause higher than the self, inferring that you experience empathy as an emotion in some capacity) and someone who claims to have a Masters in religious studies would mean that I could open up a sincere conversation about a branch of a certain religion that you seem to be relatively uninformed of, or at the very least apathetic to. you obviously care, seeing as how your response was pretty emotional, as was mine. but that's okay. "do as thou wilt"




If being indignant is how you claim to open up a discussion, then, yeah...Our conversation is over.


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## black (Apr 14, 2017)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> If being indignant is how you claim to open up a discussion, then, yeah...Our conversation is over.


I'll give you that. I didn't really ask a question i just expressed how I felt. the topic is close to my heart and I acted rashly. i'll apologize. but my primary point stands and if you feel like responding go ahead. if not, i'll let it be.


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## Andrea Van Scoyoc (Apr 14, 2017)

black said:


> I'll give you that. I didn't really ask a question i just expressed how I felt. the topic is close to my heart and I acted rashly. i'll apologize. but my primary point stands and if you feel like responding go ahead. if not, i'll let it be.




So, I take it you're a Luciferian...Former, offshoot, or some other left hand path?

Let's hear your side. I have the CoS view from a titled member in high standing.

Fill me in on Luciferianism. I've studied, but not in depth.


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## Beegod Santana (Apr 14, 2017)

Religion is for the birds. The mighty all seeing and knowing birds... Personally I see the whole indigo children thing as a mild form of child abuse. This conclusion is based solely on knowing people who were raised as such. Fucks with kid's heads hard and then one day they realize they have major learning disabilities as an adult that never got addressed in childhood because mommy thought she had a space child. Just my two cents. It ain't as evil as say, Catholicism, but I wouldn't recommend it.


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## Beegod Santana (Apr 15, 2017)

I remember this one time on dead lot I left a tray of crystals on the dash of my truck in the hot sun for a few hours and then proceeded to sell em all in about a half hr because people could "feel the energy" in them. I even told a girl they were just hot from being on a dash but she was sure she was feeling something else. Whatever, I got paid.


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## black (Apr 16, 2017)

Andrea Van Scoyoc said:


> So, I take it you're a Luciferian...Former, offshoot, or some other left hand path?
> 
> Let's hear your side. I have the CoS view from a titled member in high standing.
> 
> Fill me in on Luciferianism. I've studied, but not in depth.



Okay so i'll start by explaining the difference between Luciferianism and LaVeyan Satanism, AKA the CoS.

Anton LeVay and his church are atheists. They do not believe in any deity or any literal "satan". Objectively, the Church of Satan is a tight-knit order who value self-indulgence, and whose beliefs are mostly based on a reactionary opposition to the values of Christianity, which included piouty, perceived subservience, and "helping they neighbor". You know this stuff. I'm just typing it for notation purposes, and to properly compare it to Luciferianism.

Luciferian Satanism

Luciferians, although very broad, loose-knit, and few, come in a couple different varieties.

Gnostics are similar to gnostic Christians. They believe Lucifer, as a spiritual being of knowledge, light, self-improvement, the Sun, permeates everything around them and that Lucifer is really more of a state of "enlightenment" to be attained by practicing perceived virtues and values therein. This "branch"(and i use that word with trepedation) of Luciferian practice has many parallels with LeVays beliefs in that the primary focus is on the self, sometimes even including the factor of total opposition to the Christian way of life, with the primary difference being that Lucifer truly does exist to them just only in a broader, spiritual sense than a Theistic Luciferian might believe. 

Theistic Luciferians are the ones the believe in Lucifer as a true, singular deity whom they follow, worship, and attempt to emulate in their everyday lives. There are a few very very unofficial schools of thought within Theistic Luciferianism. I'm going to use my own made-up names for them just to convey the main points of what they believe and how they differ but i garrentee that none of them call themselves by the names im going to give them in this explanation.

1. Biblical Theistic Luciferians. These folks believe in the leader of the Satans, who they interpret as Lucifer, exactly how he is portrayed in the Christian Bible. He is the literal God of Evil, King of Hell, and the main opposing force to Christianity. He is in constant war with Jehovah over our mortal souls and his followers seek to aid him in this war. Like LeVayans they condone hedonism, and also bellieve in every other form of self-indulgence and sin you could think of. They hate Christ and his peaceful, pious nature and wholeheartedly condone violence, evil, Darwin-esque "the strongest survive and the weak are born to die" heirarchal structures, and everything that comes with it.

2. Lightbearer Theistic Luciferians (again this is completely made up on the spot by me and they do not use this name) are, like before, those who believe in a literal, meta-physical, physical, spiritual, and intervening deity named Lucifer. While rejecting many different aspects of Christianity, these folks tend not to really care about including any reactionary practices or beliefs in their worship. Their worship of Lucifer tends to be very individualistic, where developing a genuine, spiritual relationship with Lucifer is the main goal in order to better themselves. The focus of this brand of Lucifer worship is not really based in self-indulgent ideas and has many parallels with Christianity actually. Evil is not a focus in this religion and the Bible is not usually a factor whatsoever. Lucifer to them is a stand-alone deity of knowledge, self-improvement, and is usually assigned many other values and characteristics specific to those worshiping Lucifer. Sometimes there are those who include Demonolatry (not to be confused with Demonology) in their practices, where they will convene with Demons and Lesser Satans to obtain guidance and achieve many other things. This practice of Demonolatry usually comes with a slight more inclusion of Biblical belief, but not an all out acceptance of the Biblical representation of the Satans.

I was a Lightbearer Theistic Luciferian, as i have named them here simply for the purpose of highlighting their differences from others. Luciferianism is a very broad and blurry religion and some dont even see it as one. None of the name i used here are used by them at all. These are all my interpretations based on speaking with and reading about different believers. I have spoken with every different type of Luciferianism you could imagine and even though ive represented them as if there are clear-cut lines between each belief system that is truly not the case. Luciferianism is not yet very organized, there is not any prescribed doctrine, text, or way of living, and is largely defined by each individual worshiper. what i've given above is just a cheap, short, and basic set of overarching themes within Luciferianism.

I tend to be very opposed to LeVayan beliefs and ideas. I am no longer a Luciferian though. I am Fyrnsidu and i worship Thunor, Woden, Saxnot, Frig, and the like. I still really believe Lucifer exists but i think back then i simply misunderstood him, and misunderstood myself, and what i thought was Lucifer was actually Woden. Any questions?


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## black (Apr 16, 2017)

Disclaimer: I am not a Wodenist and do not associate with any ethno-centric branch of Heathenry. I tend to favor Thunor, the god of the common man.


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## DrewSTNY (Apr 16, 2017)

Interesting conversation, not sure how applicable it is to the original thread. I'm not sure the Indigo Children are born of Lucifer.

On that note, I have given some thought to the conversation thus far regarding Lucifer. @black, you really peaked my interest when you used the name "Morning Star." Not many people would refer to Lucifer by that name because they do not understand that he once held a position of the highest honor.

In my opinion, Lucifer rebeled his position as the Morning Star, the most powerful and beautiful of all the created ones in heaven in a bid for self-determination which was given to humans, but not the created beings in the service of Jehovah. He also wished to elevate himself above Jehovah and convinced many in the ranks to join him. War ensued, Lucifer, along with his legion, was defeated by the archangel Michael and his army. This resulted in banishment from heaven with the eternal sentence to wander the Earth with the humans whom he despised and considered beneath himself. 

Lucifer and those like him were created with the purpose of absolute and abject obedience to Jehovah. Humans on the otherhand were created for relationship with each other and with Jehovah as his both his equal and vassal beings. Though the true power of the human race remains hidden, they are still more powerful than the created ones in that they have self-determination. Humans can out right reject service to Jehovah and follow whatever path they choose. The result is Lucifer's jealousy along with intense anger to destroy humanity's relationship with Jehovah. Lucifer cares not that humans would worship him, only that they turn against Jehovah. 

I know that this is only my opinion, and is not necessarily held by anyone, nor does it consider the pantheon of gods that people worship in various forms; however, it only deals with the Jehovah-Lucifer based universe.


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## black (Apr 16, 2017)

on the actual thread topic, indigeau children is a ridiculous bs phenomenon propegated by idiot white liberals who dont want to think that their kids might have any kind of psychological disorder


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 18, 2017)

I feel I was born an indigo and growing up that wasn't nurtured properly and I had a fuck load of psychological problems because of it. Now I can read ppls minds talk to dead ppl and animals trees plants all that good stuff. All this ive developed on my own and it just sort of clicked after awhile even though i feel i was dispositioned for it. Im not all hippy dippy about it I can just do it. I'm actually believe it or not, a christian. Although I consider myself spiritual and not religious.


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## black (Apr 18, 2017)

Lightning Samurai said:


> I feel I was born an indigo and growing up that wasn't nurtured properly and I had a fuck load of psychological problems because of it. Now I can read ppls minds talk to dead ppl and animals trees plants all that good stuff. All this ive developed on my own and it just sort of clicked after awhile even though i feel i was dispositioned for it. Im not all hippy dippy about it I can just do it. I'm actually believe it or not, a christian. Although I consider myself spiritual and not religious.


you cannot read peoples minds or talk to dead people. I sincerely hope I don't sound like an asshole but you just cant. you cant. its impossible. its harmful to yourself to keep trying to believe that you can.


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## black (Apr 18, 2017)

I believe theres a giant bearded man in the sky who controls thunder and lightning and protects the common folk at large, so trust me, im not a normal dude whos an atheist and questions everything non-scientific. that's not me. I believe in spiritual forces. but no human is granted those abilities. those powers are for the gods and the gods alone.


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## VikingAdventurer (Apr 18, 2017)

black said:


> ... but no human is granted those abilities. those powers are for the gods and the gods alone.



I respectfully disagree with you on this one. 

There are multiple accounts, not only sprinkled throughout the Christian Bible, but in many other religions as well, where the texts mention and in some cases caution against or even outright forbid, communication with the deceased.


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 18, 2017)

black said:


> I believe theres a giant bearded man in the sky who controls thunder and lightning and protects the common folk at large, so trust me, im not a normal dude whos an atheist and questions everything non-scientific. that's not me. I believe in spiritual forces. but no human is granted those abilities. those powers are for the gods and the gods alone.


You believe in spiritual forces then you must believe that we as humans have a spiritual force within us as well. That same spiritual force is what enables us to channel information to or from higher or lower powers. Just Like your god thunor. If you can't channel that spiritual force then how can you pray to him?


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 18, 2017)

Pocket Viking said:


> I respectfully disagree with you on this one.
> 
> There are multiple accounts, not only sprinkled throughout the Christian Bible, but in many other religions as well, where the texts mention and in some cases caution against or even outright forbid, communication with the deceased.


I'd Like To Reiterate that I can talk to dead people but I don't for said reason and also kind of agree what @black said because yes it is bad for you just like the bible says. Also they're pretty pathetic really theyre kinda like homebums and you don't want em clinging to ya.


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## black (Apr 18, 2017)

now specifically about contacting the dead, I didn't quite mean what I said but only about that. I believe its possible to contact the dead in certain ways but I definitely advise against it, also it just isn't always possible. the dead don't necessarily respond to the living should you try. magic is a whole different story. but psychic powers? no.


Lightning Samurai said:


> You believe in spiritual forces then you must believe that we as humans have a spiritual force within us as well. That same spiritual force is what enables us to channel information to or from higher or lower powers. Just Like your god thunor. If you can't channel that spiritual force then how can you pray to him?



ofcourse we have spiritual being within us but I don't believe that it gives anyone the power to "read minds" or speak with animals. the sister religion to mine whom shares many gods with mine, called Asatru, has a magical practice within it called Seidr wherein the seidman practices something close to divination of the future and attempts to influence their fate. even that is very few and far between. also I would say some celtic magic has merit to it. but magic is a purely inward practice. you cant use magic to read somebody's mind. the gods would not allow you to do such a thing.

but everything ive said is pointless really. im not gonna sit and try to convince you. I suppose your beliefs are pretty harmless other than to yourself.

but the whole Indigeau Children thing is bullshit. there are kids out there that genuinely need help, might even need medication, that are being denied the help they need by their fucked up stupid ass parents who refuse to give up their preposterous special snowflake complex for long enough to realize they are transposing a spiritual idea(auras) from a mode of faith that they aren't even a part of ,nor do they know jack shit about but they appropriate it anyway, onto an impressionable young child who would easily be comvinced they are special( because who the fuck doesn't want to be special?) so that they can cling to some small measure of elevated status and wave their object of achievement(the child) around like a floppy huge metaphorical dick at PTA meetings or book club or whatever dumbass white liberal yuppie mom bullshit they go to. its ridiculous, completely ridiculous. harmful, shitty, unfounded, hippie bullshit.


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## AlwaysLost (Apr 18, 2017)

Pocket Viking said:


> I respectfully disagree with you on this one.
> 
> There are multiple accounts, not only sprinkled throughout the Christian Bible, but in many other religions as well, where the texts mention and in some cases caution against or even outright forbid, communication with the deceased.



My father talks to me sometimes and has actually saved my life. But I had to burn my uncles belongings. My aunt was using necromancy against me. 

I would also advise against contacting the dead. Its hard to turn it off once its on if your receptive to it. So stay away from the oiji board.

Sixth sense (prolly just intuition) has enabled me to do some wierd things but magic also makes me crazier.

"Always in motion the future is..."

Personally my life goes better when God is in my heart instead of Loki. But there are times when you need the darker Gods.


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 19, 2017)

black said:


> now specifically about contacting the dead, I didn't quite mean what I said but only about that. I believe its possible to contact the dead in certain ways but I definitely advise against it, also it just isn't always possible. the dead don't necessarily respond to the living should you try. magic is a whole different story. but psychic powers? no.
> 
> 
> ofcourse we have spiritual being within us but I don't believe that it gives anyone the power to "read minds" or speak with animals. the sister religion to mine whom shares many gods with mine, called Asatru, has a magical practice within it called Seidr wherein the seidman practices something close to divination of the future and attempts to influence their fate. even that is very few and far between. also I would say some celtic magic has merit to it. but magic is a purely inward practice. you cant use magic to read somebody's mind. the gods would not allow you to do such a thing.
> ...


Why won't your gods allow it? Do they not grant you free will? Magic is inward? Relative to what? imo magic is outward because your focusing energy inside of you and projecting it outward generally via ritual or other physical outward action. Could I use my psychic abilities to harm people? Yea but its the same as casting black magic its going to fuck me over in the end. Besides that it gets tiring hearing everyone else's negativity in regards to harming myself. All and all I find it pretty handy for numerous things I can tell how people perceive me if they're lying to me. I've found objects people have lost before I knew they lost it all kinds a stuff. Even though all you really need is faith to make it through this life I've found my gift pretty nifty.
About your rant I can say that may sometimes be the case but isn't one hundo percent.


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## black (Apr 19, 2017)

magic that affects the anyone but yourself is pure luck in its effect. pure luck as to whether the god answering your call will grant it, therefore all effective, true magic is an inward practice. Idc whats tiring for you to hear. its harmful and you should be told so.


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## black (Apr 19, 2017)

your idea that you somehow have powers beyond normal humanity is nothing but narcissism in its purest form


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## black (Apr 19, 2017)

complete and total narcissism. and honestly at this point im not frustrated just a little sad. a little sad that you would feel motivated to act out in this particular way. its a very obvious symptom of a larger psychological problem or at least some kind of damage to your ego at some point. my rant wasn't directed at you. your mother obviously didn't spur you into thinking youre an indigeau child. i will apologize for being antagonistic. i cant blame you for something you most likely, and i stress most likely, didn't cause. its just hard to gauge whether you would do something ridiculous like promise a friend you could speak to their dead relative, and let them down. that would almost qualify as emotional abuse. do you get where im coming from? can you understand why thinking that you have these abilities can be harmful? lets say, for instance, a large amount of people believed in you. you become what qualifies to the outside world as a "cult leader", and youre getting a great amount of worship and attention. it could end pretty badly. it WOULD end pretty badly, as it always does. i just don't think youre thinking it through all the way. that's what im getting at.


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## AlwaysLost (Apr 19, 2017)

black said:


> your idea that you somehow have powers beyond normal humanity is nothing but narcissism in its purest form



I find your lack of faith disturbing...Don't underestimate the power of the force.


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## DrewSTNY (Apr 19, 2017)

AlmostAlwaysLost said:


> I find your lack of faith disturbing...Don't underestimate the power of the force.


Too bad I can't put two ratings! You are awesome, Lost!


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## AlwaysLost (Apr 19, 2017)

DrewSTNY said:


> Too bad I can't put two ratings! You are awesome, Lost!



Thanks bro!


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 20, 2017)

black said:


> your idea that you somehow have powers beyond normal humanity is nothing but narcissism in its purest form


I think anyone can do it. Because you can't believe that I can is why you perceive me as narcissistic.


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 20, 2017)

black said:


> complete and total narcissism. and honestly at this point im not frustrated just a little sad. a little sad that you would feel motivated to act out in this particular way. its a very obvious symptom of a larger psychological problem or at least some kind of damage to your ego at some point. my rant wasn't directed at you. your mother obviously didn't spur you into thinking youre an indigeau child. i will apologize for being antagonistic. i cant blame you for something you most likely, and i stress most likely, didn't cause. its just hard to gauge whether you would do something ridiculous like promise a friend you could speak to their dead relative, and let them down. that would almost qualify as emotional abuse. do you get where im coming from? can you understand why thinking that you have these abilities can be harmful? lets say, for instance, a large amount of people believed in you. you become what qualifies to the outside world as a "cult leader", and youre getting a great amount of worship and attention. it could end pretty badly. it WOULD end pretty badly, as it always does. i just don't think youre thinking it through all the way. that's what im getting at.


All that shits against my framework of morality. Also seeking power negates your abilities because your ego will corrupt your judgement. Honestly I think the world would be a better place if we all became more in tune with eachother and gained these abilities. Think about it we would have more empathy for each other wed stop lying to each other we would be more aware of world problems and be able to exist together more peacefully on this planet. Its peoples near sightedness that really fucks shit up. If everyone had these abilities life would be a more beautiful place for us all.


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 20, 2017)

Also if somebody did want me to talk to their dead gramama it would be their fault

Leviticus 20:6“If a person turns to mediums and necromancers, whoring after them, I will set my face against that person and will cut him off from among his people

SAys it a couple other places too.


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## black (Apr 20, 2017)

what


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## black (Apr 20, 2017)

someone please shoot me in the face


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 20, 2017)

black said:


> magic that affects the anyone but yourself is pure luck in its effect. pure luck as to whether the god answering your call will grant it, therefore all effective, true magic is an inward practice. Idc whats tiring for you to hear. its harmful and you should be told so.


Then what's true magic? your being vague. And if you believe its luck then it would be coincidence and not magic but that's a dichotomy.


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 20, 2017)

black said:


> someone please shoot me in the face


well hopefully I did some good at decalcifying your pineal gland your welcome


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## black (Apr 21, 2017)

Lightning Samurai said:


> Then what's true magic? your being vague. And if you believe its luck then it would be coincidence and not magic but that's a dichotomy.


to be clear, im not a magic user. I just believe it exists. so im being vague because I have vague beliefs. my spiritual beliefs don't often involve magic or magic users of any kind other than what amounts to fortune tellers and soothsayers(in totally appropriative and simplified terms). in my faith, Gods and Goddesses are the most powerful magic users(although its arguable whether you could say magic their because they are gods), and seidr are very very very few and far between. I will say though I definitely think the magic done by the celts has a little more merit than most. so, to me, there is barely any true magic and in the context of what I said I should've used a different word than true. effective might've been better. I will note that my opinions are pretty malleable and if you believe in magic unlike the magic I believe in I will not antagonize you.


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## VikingAdventurer (Apr 21, 2017)

black said:


> your idea that you somehow have powers beyond normal humanity is nothing but narcissism in its purest form



How do you define "powers beyond normal humanity"?




Lightning Samurai said:


> I think anyone can do it. Because you can't believe that I can is why you perceive me as narcissistic.



I tend to agree with this line of thinking. I also believe that all humans are ABLE to do magic, however some are more sensitive or less sensitive to those abilities. 

Also some people choose TO do magic, and others choose NOT to.


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## AlwaysLost (Apr 22, 2017)

Pocket Viking said:


> How do you define "powers beyond normal humanity"?
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Agreed we don't actually know all that much about the human brain or all the varying behavior s of energy.


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## Beegod Santana (Apr 26, 2017)

Anyone wanna buy a shiny rock?


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## Desperado Deluxe (Apr 29, 2017)

I think magic is vague and relative. Anything can be magic. To spell it magick is to give it occult connotation. What you do may be magic but your intent is what makes the difference in spelling.


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