# Farming & ranching the Slabs



## Pheonix (Mar 14, 2012)

My name's Pheonix and I have been here for awhile, first came to this site as a retired hobo and current farmer. But shit happened and now I back in CA doing the hobo thing again, good thing I already have 8 years experience in the field of Hobotology. But the thing is I still want to advance my Farming and Ranching experience and want to get another farm.
Lately I've been wondering if I would be able to farm and ranch at Slab City. So I figured I should start doing some research on the Slabs and have many questions that I was hoping I could get answers to here.

Do people have chickens and/or rabbits out there?
Do people have goats out there?
Can I fence in a small area out there and set up camp inside the fence to keep my animals safe and to keep my guard dog corralled with the flock/herd?
How do people get water out there?
What are the electricity options out there?
Is there a way to get internet out there? if yes how?
Can I build a permanent structure out there? I.E. chicken coop, storage shed, greenhouse.

I'm sure I will have more questions later but these are the ones I'm thinking of right now.


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## happyearthhomes (Mar 14, 2012)

Yes to chickens
yes to goats
no to rabbits but wild ones exist
Yes claiming and fencing a camp is possible
you haul it in from town or pay waterboy $15 for 100 gallons delivered to your camp he leases you a tank for a $20 one time fee and he maintains the tanks
you run a generator or get solar stuff.
a local provider called beam speed for $65 a month ok speeds im on it now
sure just be aware at any time you can be evicted by the cops thats why I am leaving to build my place somewhere else o and also the 120!!! degree heat for 3-4 months if you do come out you can try joining up with one of the existing camps that already have the basics done some camps take in people regularly if your cool. the camp i am leaving is well known to stp a few members have and do live here and quite a few more have visited


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## Pheonix (Mar 14, 2012)

That sounds great, here's another question. What cell phone service provider has the best reception out there?


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## dprogram (Mar 14, 2012)

Just curious but...Why can't rabbits come out there?


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## Pheonix (Mar 14, 2012)

I think he meant that no one out there has rabbits. If that's the case I'll probably be the first.


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## Kim Chee (Mar 15, 2012)

Rabbits wont be able to handle the heat (except underground). Even with ample shade/water the heat will have them dropping like flies. Maybe there is a "heat resistant" variety?


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## happyearthhomes (Mar 15, 2012)

U can get 4g on at&t 3g on everything else the reason no one has rabbits is the slab dog packs and coyotes


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## Pheonix (Mar 15, 2012)

yes, I would have to find a heat resistant breed of rabbit, the ones I had last time had heat strokes when the temp got to 110. As for the dogs that's why I want a fence.

Does everyone let their dogs run around off a leash? Can I shoot the coyotes? Are the wild rabbits Jackrabbits? Is there good fishing at Salton Sea? How far is the nearest hardware store?


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## Matt Derrick (Mar 15, 2012)

i wouldn't eat anything out of the salton sea. you'll take one look at it and agree with me. in a lot of places it's nothing but brown sludge, and almost everywhere it smells like crap. there's so many dead fish on the shore that the beaches are largely made up of fish bones, so the sand crunches under your feet.

nearest hardware store is in calipatria, which is about 10 or 15 miles south. there are some dogs running around without a leash, but it's kinda rare from my experience. i mean, i don't think ive seen any dog on a leash, but they're well trained enough that they don't leave their buddie's camp, which makes sense, cause then we would have a bunch of dogs getting in fights all the time, and ive almost never seen that happen here.

you can shoot the coyotes for sure, but they rarely come into places where humans are, especially if youre in the more central slab area.

as for "you may be evicted at any time by the cops" that's extremely unlikely for several reasons that would take a long time to explain. slab city is a piece of land that's fallen under some unique circumstances, and has been that way for over 50 years, so it's unlikely to change anytime soon.


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## Pheonix (Mar 16, 2012)

That's good to hear, my dogs are also well trained. The thing is one of my dogs is a well trained guard dog and I'll have her tied up at camp until I get a fence up, but she won't want strange humans and dogs coming up into camp. So I was wondering if dogs will stay away from my camp and not come running to play with the new dog? I'm also a little anti-social so I would prefer to camp somewhere with less people and not in the middle of the already established camps.

Are there snakes out there?
Are they venomous?


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## Matt Derrick (Mar 16, 2012)

personally i don't think you'll have too many problems with other dogs. as for snakes, yes, there is some, but ive never seen one. i know some people that have, but it's pretty rare, i think they try to stay away from humans though. im not sure if any are poisonous, i kinda doubt it.


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## Pheonix (Mar 17, 2012)

Is the ground loose sand or loose sand on top of sandstone, what I'm saying is how hard is it going to be to dig 4 or 5 feet into the ground?
Will I need a matox?

I guess my main concern should be how to survive a 120 degree summer? huh

I'll be getting on food stamps and I'm sure many people out there have them too. So does that grocery in Niland turn into a crowded free-for-all at the beginning of the month?
Can I pick up cheap dog food in Niland?


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## Matt Derrick (Mar 17, 2012)

not sure about dog food, im sure they have it, but no idea how much it costs. the ground isn't too hard most of the time that you can't dig into it with just a shovel.


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## Pheonix (Mar 18, 2012)

well, it seems like that's going to be the plan. I'll panhandle for a couple months to get money for supplies and then move to the slabs sometime at the beginning of summer.
Anybody have anymore suggestions and what I should bring as far as supplies? or any other advice?


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## Chris Catastrophe (Mar 18, 2012)

be careful of the snakes mid season, especialy if your anywhere near the canal. we caught and ate alot of rattlers there. lived there for a long time. watch other ppls dogs they keep some of them on leash but there are many wild dogs and some coyotes, small game may draw them in. as for water matt said it best the water guy is the best, and if u cant get ahold of him right away the gas station in town has a water tap outside by the bathrooms they will let u fill up any amount. if u use the water there tip, theres a jar inside they use all donations for paying the water bill. the niland beverage store and maves have dog food general foodstuffs at an ok cost, food stamps are easy to get. take the 1$ bus to el centro. if ur going in the begining of summer be preppared for some serious heat, 110+. highest it was when i got there was 126. if u need more info pm me id be happy to answer what i can. good luck


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## Matt Derrick (Mar 18, 2012)

yeah, if you want to get a large amount of staple goods, i think taking the bus to the "food 4 less" in el centro is your best bet. May's (the grocery in niland) is a bit pricey and has a limited selection.


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## Pheonix (Mar 18, 2012)

good to know I can eat snakes out there since jackrabbits and coyotes taste like shit, but is there anything else out there that can be hunted, trapped or fished for food?

How is the toilet situation? Are there community shitters or do I need to make my own?


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## Chris Catastrophe (Mar 18, 2012)

didnt even think of 4 for less, good call. there r a few outhouses build, one by the ''cafe'', another by the kitchen. recommend bucket w seat or dig one. there are some fish in the canal, not much though. rabbits n quail r good eats there. the blue n white church has water n may help w food, plus ppl come in w food as well.


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## Matt Derrick (Mar 18, 2012)

yeah, and karma kitchen feeds every thursday, and the church in the slabs gives away food to occasionally. there's also some other church thing that comes out about once a month to feed and give people stuff. it's kinda hard to starve here.


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## Pheonix (Mar 20, 2012)

I'd imagine the barter system is used out there. What are good trade stock items??


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## Pheonix (Jun 4, 2012)

Matt Derrick said:


> the only tanks left are the two painted tanks that i linked you pictures to. they're about 14 feet high, so it's hard to get in them. if you built a ladder to go over so you could get in and out you'd be set. no one's ever taken the time to do that, so you could totally claim one if you wanted, and as long as you didn't fuck up the murals on the outside, i doubt anyone would bother you about it, they'd just think you were crazy for wanting to live somewhere in the desert without a roof. the insides have virtually no graffitti at all, and have concrete floors too.


 
Yes, I'm all ready designing something in my head. The concrete floors provide easy clean up the chickens will need some sort of bedding/litter on the ground witch will all have to be scooped up and replaced frequently. The chicken bedding and crap is good fertilizer, but there needs to be a way to safely and easily haul in and haul out supplies without ruining the art on the walls. I'm thinking of building some sort of tower next to the tank with a bridge going over to the roof of the tank. The roof should be designed in a way to keep the inside in the shade at all times. The outside should stay in the shade at all times too in an effort to keep the sun from heating the concrete any more then it already is. From the satellite image it looks like there's still supporting studs for a roof just no cross beams. Pulley lift systems can be placed on the tower and inside the tank for loading and unloading supplies. The concrete floors are good snake prevention too.



mmmmmmmichael said:


> Rabbits wont be able to handle the heat (except underground). Even with ample shade/water the heat will have them dropping like flies. Maybe there is a "heat resistant" variety?


 
this is the type of rabbit I was gonna look into
http://www.caller.com/news/2008/mar/14/ag_column/


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## Cardboard (Jun 5, 2012)

Hey phoenix, I am just checking in right now, but send me an email about this... I have been considering this for many years, and have spent a lot of time in the slabs in the past. There was a guy out there a few years ago with some donkeys, and he was farming algae, worked fine for him...
Anyways, I could tell you my thoughts and plans of where/what to do, just not right now... hit me up @
[email protected]
Briefly, consider these things:
THe soil is terrible wasteland shit. THere is however a lot of huge cattle industry places around, and even within walking distace of the slabs, a catfish farm. Im sure getting a large amount of shit would just take the effort, and asking.
once you get your soil conditioned, consider the watering issue, do a little research on moorish irrigation, I waas working with it all last year in my garden in andalucia, it works great. It is a lot of work, but all you need is a shovel, a water source (consider getting the water quality of the hotsprings tested, as pulling of the canal will get you busted in no time...), and a shange in elevation...
water towers, boreholes, and solar pumps are another option, but its gonna take a hell of a lot of money...
Anyway, hit me up, and I will briefly explain my idea to you. I have been farming my whole life more or less, and traveling and working on farms in more than 20 countries, lots of climates... I know a bit about how to make these things happen.
'Keep it up though man, great idea, I wish I was there to manifest it, but the farm I am on in portugal is too nice to leave right now


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## Pheonix (Jun 5, 2012)

Cardboard, I don't check my email very often so it would be better for me if we PMed though this site. I was thinking of buying water from water boy since it's easy and fair priced, but a water tower would be a great project and I'm definitely interested in hearing more about that.
I had the crappy wasteland soil problem in Oklahoma too. Potatoes and peanuts do well in high sand soils. The environment of Oklahoma was brutal on my crops and it made me switch my focus from farming to ranching. I don't know if I'm better with animals then I am with plants or if the OK weather is, but I'd like to keep my focus on ranching. I hope someone else would like to take the farming initiative as this will have to be a group effort to establish a well organized farming & ranching community.


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## Matt Derrick (Jun 7, 2012)

oh, and on a side note, there's a very decent hardware store about 10-15 miles away in brawley. good for buying soil, tools, or whatever.


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## Pheonix (Jun 7, 2012)

Actually I'm thinking about getting a 12 foot scaffolding with wheels to make building easier and since it's a concrete floor inside we can wheel it around inside the tank to help in building a roof of some sorts. It's a good thing I came back to my idea of farming the slabs since I was about to throw all my chicken & rabbit gear away since no one on craigslist wants to buy it.

Also wondering if anyone knows how to go about getting this farm set-up as a non-profit charity so that I could ask farmers and other people to donate supplies and it would be tax deductible for them. I think we could get a lot of supplies if we were a non-profit. Any ideas or opinions of having this farm a non-profit charity?


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## Cardboard (Jun 8, 2012)

concerning the waterboy... 100 gallons isnt going to do shit for a garden. maybe wet the topsoil for 15 minutes untill the wind an sun takes it away. Really better off trying to either have a vehicle, and making trips with 1-2 pallet tanks minimum, a solar pump and a water tower, or pulling from the hot springs or canal (the canal will get you busted fast though...)
Concerning the rabbits, maybe you can find domesticated hares? there isnt much for wild rabbit out there, but there are hares like crazy. and the meat is nicer in my opinion. Take care for protein poisoning and worms with these kinds of animals.
Out in the slabs, if you had a good grazing area built, you could handle some goats, some donkeys, maybe a llama/alpaca, but not so much more without massive cost.
Free foods include grapefruits and occasionally other citrus from the nearby orchards, catfish if you go ask the workers for some, and the other things people mentioned.
I would not consider building much on top of the tanks (as a roof). glass would make too much heat, and if you need shade, rather use plants.


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## Kim Chee (Jun 8, 2012)

Pheonix said:


> Also wondering if anyone knows how to go about getting this farm set-up as a non-profit charity so that I could ask farmers and other people to donate supplies and it would be tax deductible for them. I think we could get a lot of supplies if we were a non-profit. Any ideas or opinions of having this farm a non-profit charity?


 
If you are willing to go through that much trouble, maybe consider writing/applying for a grant.


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## Pheonix (Jun 8, 2012)

mmmmmmmichael said:


> If you are willing to go through that much trouble, maybe consider writing/applying for a grant.


 
I don't want the government's money, but if the people that donate to the farm do then I want them to have a tax write off.



Cardboard said:


> concerning the waterboy... 100 gallons isnt going to do shit for a garden. maybe wet the topsoil for 15 minutes untill the wind an sun takes it away. Really better off trying to either have a vehicle, and making trips with 1-2 pallet tanks minimum, a solar pump and a water tower, or pulling from the hot springs or canal (the canal will get you busted fast though...)
> Concerning the rabbits, maybe you can find domesticated hares? there isnt much for wild rabbit out there, but there are hares like crazy. and the meat is nicer in my opinion. Take care for protein poisoning and worms with these kinds of animals.
> Out in the slabs, if you had a good grazing area built, you could handle some goats, some donkeys, maybe a llama/alpaca, but not so much more without massive cost.
> Free foods include grapefruits and occasionally other citrus from the nearby orchards, catfish if you go ask the workers for some, and the other things people mentioned.
> I would not consider building much on top of the tanks (as a roof). glass would make too much heat, and if you need shade, rather use plants.


 
Would I only be able to get 1 tank from Waterboy? I was actually hoping for 2 or 3 tanks that would get refilled as needed.
I want a mutated inbred hairless rabbit that has been bred by a university in Texas to be used to help feed people in hot desert lands. I think due to the humanitarian efforts of the professor if we were a non-profit charity feeding homeless Americans in a hot desert region then the professor might be more willing to let us get some of his rabbits.
I was wondering about building a roof around solar panels but a living roof would be amazing. Maybe we could incorporate both into the design of the roof. I wasn't even thinking of using glass as a roof, that is a bad idea.


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## uncivilize (Jun 8, 2012)

How close to the washes are you? Could you build some high capacity swales, divert water from the washes when the floods come through, and let it soak into the ground (one of the best places to store water for trees). Use a shit load of organic material to mulch the berms, which will be fertilizer, provide habitat for microorganisms, protect the soil from evaporation. plant some mesquite, deep taproots that help with deeper soil saturation, and they fix nitrogen right out of the air, plant date palms, which would eventually be a great canopy layer, providing shade, cooling the immediate area a bit, wind block, more evaporative protection, etc. Pomegranates, figs, citrus eventually. Goats, pigeons.



Geoff Lawton's "greening the desert" stuff goes way more in depth than just what you see in the videos. They use plants that will actually bring the salt out of the soil, lock it up, bring animals through to graze it, add a bunch of organic material, plant less salt tolerant plants. That is a gross oversimplification, but he's doing some cool shit in the dead sea valley of Jordan, which is one of the hottest, driest places in the world.


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## Matt Derrick (Jun 8, 2012)

Pheonix said:


> Would I only be able to get 1 tank from Waterboy? I was actually hoping for 2 or 3 tanks that would get refilled as needed.


 
you can get as many tanks from waterboy as you're willing to pay for. i think it's like 65 bucks a barrel (which includes the stand).

also, i would recommend going to slab city and feeling out the situation and your ideas with the local community before you go investing a lot of money or materials into the project.


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## Pheonix (Jun 8, 2012)

Matt Derrick said:


> also, i would recommend going to slab city and feeling out the situation and your ideas with the local community before you go investing a lot of money or materials into the project.


 
I understand what your saying and I agree, however this time of year ain't the best time to visit the slabs. I'm wanting to start this project in the fall when it starts to cool down. I guess writing to the EJ site about my project would be a great start. I'm not hauling material around the country (except for what I already got) but I'm gonna hustle all summer long so I'll have the funds for the material. When I get there and if the community doesn't want me to do what I want to do then I will have the cash to go somewhere else and do what I want to do.

Once again, great idea but I'm not going out there for the first time in the summer.


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## Matt Derrick (Jun 8, 2012)

i understand, i just think you're presuming a lot based on what you've been told on the internet, and you might find it much different in person. example:



Pheonix said:


> I guess writing to the EJ site about my project would be a great start.


 
I don't think you realize that while EJ is inside the slab city area, they are of the general attitude that they are not a part of "the slabs" and don't really interact all that much with them (for better or worse), and won't really have an opinion about what you want to do with the tanks. they will also consider you to be another "big talker" on the internet, since they get a lot of those types (especially after i designed the website for them) contacting them all the time. once you get there and start doing it, EJ will take you seriously.

But most importantly, you're going to want to see what the slab community (i.e. everyone but EJ) is going to think about an occupation of the tanks. i don't think they'll have a problem with it, but it's not something you'll be able to breach with them over the internet, it'll have to be done in person.

and in the end, if an occupation of the tanks upsets the slabbers that much, there is PLENTY of other space in slab city to do what you want to do.

not trying to criticize of course, just trying to provide some constructive advice


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## happyearthhomes (Jun 14, 2012)

"I don't think you realize that while EJ is inside the slab city area, they are of the general attitude that they are not a part of "the slabs" and don't really interact all that much with them (for better or worse), and won't really have an opinion about what you want to do with the tanks. they will also consider you to be another "big talker" on the internet, since they get a lot of those types (especially after i designed the website for them) contacting them all the time. once you get there and start doing it, EJ will take you seriously."



There is no single person in charge of the slabs its best to go and talk to different people out there and just do your thing regardless. EJ has its own thing going on and will not be much help to anyone not within their claimed area (You mushroom stamped that sites ass Matt while yelling ART in its face)


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## Matt Derrick (Jun 14, 2012)

happyearthhomes said:


> (You mushroom stamped that sites ass Matt while yelling ART in its face)


 
i totally don't understand what that means.


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## happyearthhomes (Jun 20, 2012)

It was what chris tallfucker benton said to the gay google guys one drunkin night also i am an idiot


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## barefootinbabylon (Jul 1, 2012)

Pheonix ~

Please see my post on MI farmin'; i've seen your posts 'round here, and you seem like an awesome, knowledgeable person. With MOST places, not just AZ/southern CA, water will be in short, short supply in a very short while. I don't know if creating a 'farm' out in the desert is really... foreseeable. Anyways. Best of luck, keep up da good fight.


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