# guy busted living in cave 11 years



## thunderson5

guy was living in a cave for 11 years before he got busted.some local turned him in,said they saw a suspeciuos camp sight,what,anyways they gave him a year probation and banned him for life from going into that national forest didnt even know they could do that.atleast they let him go back and get his stuff,escourted ofcourse by the forest nazi"s and when they got there they asked him if he had any weapons in there and he had a bb gun and some knives abd they went in and got them before letting him back in to get his stuff,wow.in my opinion they should have let him live there till he died.this was in flagstaff arizona.the people who turned him in should get there ass kicked


----------



## keg

bbbbbbb


----------



## genghis braun

dayum. kudos to that guy for living there that long. fuck snitches! that dude wasn't harming anybody.


----------



## jabbyscabby

genghis braun said:


> dayum. kudos to that guy for living there that long. fuck snitches! that dude wasn't harming anybody.



Seriously .......FUCK YA FUCK YA,
I want to give that guy a handshake. I dont see any wrong in what he is doing!
I wonder if these people thought they where helping him!! Because there fucking idiots!


----------



## dirty_rotten_squatter

Damn, I feel sorry for that guy! Now he has no home after 11 fuckin years, fucked up man


----------



## tsilavivrus

that's fucking ridiculous. like you can kick someone out of a national forest because someone owns it or something...


----------



## dirtyfacedan

fascism is alive and well.


----------



## genghis braun

tsilavivrus said:


> that's fucking ridiculous. like you can kick someone out of a national forest because someone owns it or something...



well, in the government's eyes, THEY own it...though I personally I think that land ownership is a pretty fucked concept


----------



## dirtyfacedan

A similar story up here. I sometimes think things are different up here...for some fucked reason. I'm usually awakened to the fact things are not...

Couple living on Crown land told to tear cabin down

Couple living on Crown land told to tear cabin down


By Robert Koopmans, Kamloops Daily NewsAugust 25, 2009Comments (16)



KAMLOOPS — It has taken Tony Smith two years to build his cabin.

He dragged the logs from the bush with a yoke and the strength of his legs. Then he and his wife Judy lifted each one of the 1,000-pound beasts into place with an old boat winch.

For the couple, the cabin will be a massive improvement from the nine-by-12-foot canvas-wall prospector’s tent they have lived in on Greenstone Mountain for the past two years.

“It will be nice to have a wall that doesn’t move,” Smith said, looking every bit the proud craftsman. “This is my home.”

But it sits on Crown land.

Smith said it was like being kicked in the chest when two government workers showed up Sunday evening and told him he had 30 days to tear it down.

The two officials, a conservation officer and a compliance officer with B.C.’s Integrated Land Management Bureau, rolled in and told them someone had complained about their set-up. They told the Smiths they would also have to pull up their tent.

“They were civil,” Smith said. “He said it was policy. He said we couldn’t be here. That’s all he would say, that’s all he ever said.

“It’s policy.”

It’s a long path that led Tony, 63, and Judy, 53, to the small landing off the Dairy Lake forest service road 14 kilometres up Greenstone Mountain, southwest of Kamloops.

They married 17 years ago and have lived and worked in a number of B.C. communities. He’s a mechanic by trade and she has worked in various fields, including social work.

Several years ago, Judy’s health deteriorated — Tony describes her as a “fragile diabetic” who struggles daily to maintain her blood sugar levels — and she couldn’t work any more.

He said the stress of trying to keep a job and look after his wife at the same time was too much. He chose to stay at home to care for her, as he could not afford to pay for a home nurse.

The couple did their best to live on Judy’s disability pension but after rent and utilities, there was nothing left. The only rentals they could afford were often dirty and run-down. Landlords did nothing to fix what wasn’t working. They tried to find social housing. They were offered waiting lists.

“The system and the support services were never really there when we needed them,” he said.

After a couple of years of living poorly, Tony said he “started looking.” He cruised the backcountry until he found the overgrown road leading into the trees to the small knoll overlooking the valley below.

There, he and Judy staked out the prospector tent with its canvas walls and wood stove and single bed. They laid down a wooden floor and started cutting firewood.

“I asked myself, ‘What can I do to make sure I had heat and a reasonably clean place to live,’” he said. “I’ve worked in the bush before. I’ve lived like this.

“This is it.”

Without rent to pay, the couple’s income goes further. The money is tight and requires careful managing, but both say they have just enough to get by.

It’s tough living, especially in the winter. They have to shovel their 500 metres of road to the main road by hand, so Tony can get his old Ford truck out to town to get supplies once a month.

But Judy says her health has improved, although she can’t explain why. Maybe it’s the lack of stress, she said, or the cleaner living. She still has diabetes and tests her blood regularly, but she does not have the same problems she once did.

They are happy, they said, with a better quality of life than they had living in Kamloops. They have more food, are warmer and feel more secure.

And then the officials showed up.

Tony said he’s not looking for anything from anyone. He doesn’t want money or donations. He just wants to be able to stay where he is, to live in his cabin and look after his wife.

“We took responsibility for our situation, we solved our homeless problem, we fixed it ourselves. We didn’t throw it on the backs of the taxpayer,” he said.

“I’m home. This is home to me. They can come and rip it down around me, I’m not leaving.”

He stands on the roof of the cabin and points out the impressive view, with Crown forests stretching as far as anyone can see.

“With all of that space, I don’t know why we can’t stay here,” he said.

Officials with the Integrated Land Management Bureau could not be reached for comment.

Kamloops lawyer John Drayton said there are no so-called “squatter’s rights” in B.C. and there never have been. According to the law, the Smiths have no right to build a cabin as they have done, and the government has every right to tear it down.

If the Smiths press the point, Drayton said it’s likely the government would seek an injunction and eventually call on the RCMP to enforce it.

Drayton said he’s not so sure the government can demand they remove their tent, referring to a recent B.C. Supreme Court judgment dealt with the City of Victoria’s bylaws governing “tenters’ rights” in city parks.

That case may have some bearing on the Smiths’ situation, although it’s difficult to know how it would be interpreted if applied to these facts.

“They have no right to construct a cabin on Crown land,” Drayton said, “although many people do it, sometimes for many years, because they go undetected.

“They do it by the grace of God, for as long as they go undetected.”

Kamloops Daily News


----------



## the wizard

that's fucking sick.


----------



## CelticWanderer

Wasnt the US built on people building their homes in the middle of fucking no where?

ya know, after killing all the people that were already doing that.


----------



## Odin

I feel vicious.

It's those at the bottom that find reason to rise up.

In time.

V for Vendetta.


----------



## Kal

To hell with the government, oops I meant tyrants, what ever happen to freedom? I wish I could time travel I would go back to the 1800s back then you could go where you wanted and camp where you wanted.


----------



## CelticWanderer

Kal said:


> To hell with the government, oops I meant tyrants, what ever happen to freedom? I wish I could time travel I would go back to the 1800s back then you could go where you wanted and camp where you wanted.


and if someone stole your shit or seriously wronged you, you could just fuckin shoot em and that was that.


----------



## Deleted member 2626

Man I've always said I was born too late. I can almost feel those days deep down in my mind. Their have always politics and stuff but yeah you could disappear legally and not be arrested for living off the land


----------



## skillpore

similar story : http://zerocurrency.blogspot.com/2014_12_02_archive.html video on the guy


----------



## Odin

@skillpore that post in the zerocurency blog on money oneness and division is epic. 
Real good commentary on monotheism and cross religion similarities. 
Thanks for sharing I am gonna have to keep up.


----------



## Harmonica Bruce

Say what you want, the only reason we HAVE forests is because we don't let people just squat on them. If we did, we'd have no forests. Why not BUY a little land and build a cabin? You know, or should know, that if you build a cabin on public land it's going to be torn down.


----------



## Odin

https://sites.google.com/site/livingwithoutmoney/a-culture-living-gift-economy-today

This is priceless... I'm reading through this site all of it.


----------



## Anagor

Harmonica Bruce said:


> Say what you want, the only reason we HAVE forests is because we don't let people just squat on them. If we did, we'd have no forests.


I think there are not enough squatters to fill the forests in the US ...


----------



## Coywolf

thunderson5 said:


> guy was living in a cave for 11 years before he got busted.some local turned him in,said they saw a suspeciuos camp sight,what,anyways they gave him a year probation and banned him for life from going into that national forest didnt even know they could do that.atleast they let him go back and get his stuff,escourted ofcourse by the forest nazi"s and when they got there they asked him if he had any weapons in there and he had a bb gun and some knives abd they went in and got them before letting him back in to get his stuff,wow.in my opinion they should have let him live there till he died.this was in flagstaff arizona.the people who turned him in should get there ass kicked



Im from Flagstaff Arizona and i have never heard of this. Im currently doing some reasearch.....


----------



## Coywolf

Holy shit. I have spent nights in the same area on that mountain when i was homeless in flagstaff. Very interesting.


----------



## skillpore

@SIB If you find anything let me know. I'm down in Mesa.


----------



## Coywolf

I found the article, it is from 2003 in the Daily Sun Newspaper. Never heard about it though...
http://azdailysun.com/mount-elden-c...cle_207fff91-026f-5d38-8fd9-a8042d8edb33.html


----------



## creature

probably some fucking lawyer on a day trip with $200 glasses & nike hiking sneakers..

"there's a homeless person out here in the middle of nowhere!! i must call the cops!!"

man.. just reading it makes me nauseous..

& just reading it makes me wish for the *real* revolution...


----------



## creature

Harmonica Bruce said:


> Say what you want, the only reason we HAVE forests is because we don't let people just squat on them. If we did, we'd have no forests. Why not BUY a little land and build a cabin? You know, or should know, that if you build a cabin on public land it's going to be torn down.



you know what, mr. harmonica??

that is one of the stupid sheep follow sheep sort of attitudes that keeps the poor fucking poor..
i bet YOU are happy we killed off all the fucking native americans & took their land..

so WE can have 'national forests'..

don't want any fucking indians living in the woods, right??

the white man would have to shoot them or something...

what a fucking ...arghh.. stupid is too kind to mark it.. what a ridiculous.. hilarious thing to say..

i dunno, man.. maybe you were joking, in which case it's a good laugh..

but for your fucking information..

I **HAVE** bought a couple of acres, in just about the middle of fucking no place AND I CAN'T BUILD ON IT becuase i can't afford to build to code.. AND.. dig this.. I CAN'T PARK A FUCKING RV ON IT, LONG TERM!!!

& why?? because the fucking farmer whose cows whose fucking ***COWS*** are on it can bitch, that's why!!
if it were total fucking desert i could probably get away with it, but it zoned.. fucking ZONED 'grazing', so guess fucking what??
fuck..

christ jesus fuck hell almighty..

people with minds like yours is why there is no hope for fucking humanity, except for the unexpected darwinian improvement..

i have to go puke, now..


----------



## creature

BTW... looking up the couple of books the article refers to, on his shelf..:
"Practical Taoism" "The Portable Dragon: The Western Man's Guide to the I-Ching"

i figure if that fucker did 11 years in a cave, he knows what he's fucking reading...


----------



## skillpore

@SIB Thanks for the link. Truly sad, a hermit living in peace. With bats and mice survived for 11 years disease free. Forced out because residency is illegal? Tell that to the animals that call the mountain home. Is he no different then the bats and mice he lived with?


----------



## creature

Correct!! Definitely thanks for the link, SIB..

always best to have something *reasonable* to rant about...

: )

or.. hell.. UN-reasonable...


----------



## Coywolf

I agree with you creature, but we cant just have everyone living in the forest, or we would have no forest to live in. Id rather it be illegal, and me outsmart the cops but squatting in a place no one would find (read "Haduke Lives" by Ed Abby), than have some dumb asses bringing out tons of mattresses and trash to fuck up the only wild land we have left. Ill leave the cities for them to fuck up. But this is Flagstaff we are talking about guys. the police and Feds are ridiculous there, im sure anyone who has talked to FPD will know what im talking about. this is why I left Arizona.


----------



## Deleted member 2626

Yes! Another abbey fan. I want to read hayduke lives. I figured that he was living in the mountains somewhere. Read abbeys friend doug peacock


----------



## Coywolf

Edward abby is a major voice in all of my thoughts on life. Ill check out Peacock.


----------



## creature

i dunno, man.. i mean how many feral homeless people in the deeper forest are there, really?
& frankly, most of the trashing.. mattresses, garbage & debris.. that are left on forest land are by **housed** people who just don't want to go through the trouble of dumping their shit properly...

people who live in the forest, full time, living off the land or using it in a viable fashion are *so* fucking rare that it seems they are found more by accident than by their numbers..

& i will reiterate:
*why* can't we have everyone living in the forest???

i mean.. apart from the facts that native americans used & were *part* of nearly every ecosystem on this continent prior to the arrival of european caucasians, and apart from the fact that by far and away "everyone" does *not* want to live in the forest, what would it mean if they did?

it means they would have to take care of it, otherwise.. ta da!! it becomes a non-forest-village-city, such as now exists where the forest *had* existed.. 
yes, i'll grant that begs the question, a little, but the point is that people who want to live in the forest *as* a forest don't build houses, per se..
they live in caves, rough shacks, shelters, yurts, teepees, tents, etc., & *have* to live reasonably so they don't poison their wells..
they aren't there for comfort, primarily.. they are there for beauty..

& *not* to just visit..

if *everyone* wanted to live in the forest, & *keep* it a forest, then we would be fucking *blessed*...

but we don't, & the problem isn't the homeless, the drunks or the fringe hard-nuts who can do it well..

the problem is the people whom will exploit it..

& the solution, my friend, is *not* to keep people from using the forest, but to make what *hurts* the forest illegal..
fucking development is this planet's cancer, & you don't cure it by stopping people whom love her from being part of her.

you stop the things that make her not her.

government "protection" of the forest or other wild ecosystems is just a method for applied moral blindness..

take a look at the native central americans fighting for their heritage...

what the fuck would happen if *everyone* lived like them???

they'd be fucking forest people...

right?

but, hey.. the forest needs to be preserved, because after all, the *non* forest people want to destroy it, since *that* generates $$$..

"fucking burn that wood.. chop it down.. sell it..
but... make sure you leave some behind to be *protected*, because hey, it's immoral to kill it all, right??"

we are a fungal infection..
we are a fucking cancer..
we are like *any* mindless bacterium..

we eat what we can eat until we die in our shit..

there's a name for this law of biological behavior.. i forget who noted it originally, but basically any genoform will eat & recreate until all resources required for it to do so are exhausted.. bacteria, fish, insect, primate, flower, fungus, rodent, shellfish... *any* of them.. of us..

the ecologic balance of life is not primitive animal wisdom.. it is a law of eat & reproduce & die..
the balance is held simply in the race between what is eaten & what eats..
even plants.. what gathers sun (or thermal energy, at deep sea vents) or what crowds out the other competing plant..

even symbiosis is not wisdom, but an extension of that balance or greed & lust vs. available resources...

& humans are like no other creature, because we can eat (e.g. use) just about fucking *anything*, and *we* use fucking ***tools*** to do it, so we aren't even constrained by the old forces, unless you consider the ultimate extention of them, which is that we devour this fucking planet untill there is not enough left of her to do anything, except give us whatever pleasure we desire to keep of it..

Jesus..
hell, man..

everyone *******should******* live in the forest...


don't mean to be too snarky, but by analogy *&* extention.. 
you can't defend keeping dolphins in an aquarium, because it isn't safe for them at sea, right?

unless you change what makes it unsafe..

right?

right.

man.. the people to be fined are the people who keep fucking building..


----------



## Coywolf

Your post makes sense, my friend. I am a protector of the wilderness. I usually am found living in it. But, until we can get the message out there that the only "god" we should be praising is our own ecosystem, I fear the human race will destroy the main idea many of us find dear, wilderness. I will continue my quest to educate the populous.


----------



## Odin

I like a lot of what both sides are saying here.

Let me throw... an undeveloped... idea out there?

We want to protect nature and get back to it right? 
Yet as a species we seem to be inclined to progress forward in what was first an industrial and now artificial and technical way.
I don't know if people can stop progress... it will either end in magnificence or disaster.
I want to live a natural life away from society as much as anyone...
But I think those people that will advance and save the race from its own excess... are those in science who will find a way to adapt science to be non harmful yet productive for humans.
So I have a conflict between become those forest people and being part of a system that is abhorrent in its current nature.
... 
Perhaps my reaction is the worst possible...one of partial paralysis... 
But I would like to think... I would like to be the optimist. 
That sooner or later those of rational and scientific thought... and those of spiritual and kind emotions... will find a way to move us all forward.
I guess thats what I'm looking for?
And a beer... and a few laughs with dames and blokes.
::drinkingbuddy::


----------



## skillpore

Japans Naked Island Hermit


----------



## WithinuWithoutu

Odin said:


> https://sites.google.com/site/livingwithoutmoney/a-culture-living-gift-economy-today
> 
> This is priceless... I'm reading through this site all of it.


Definitely amazing stuff!!


----------

