# Dealing with mental health and anger during 2020



## Coywolf (Oct 5, 2020)

Hey all,

I've been trying to develop my career over the past few years so that I am able to have a work/travel balance. There is this work schedule in my field called 'career-seasonal' that you can work between 6-10 months a year and you essentially get laid off for months at a time, and have a job waiting for you when you come back.

Ive been trying to obtain this for YEARS now. I finally snagged a position up in the PNW last June....then the shit hit the fan.

During the last few years I've been ultra-pissed about what was going on in this country (US), but I was like 'hey man, hold it down, you will get your job and things will be ok'....and they arent.

I felt like when I obtained some sort if security that I would be happier. Chill out a bit. Be able to still fight for what I believe in, hold a job, travel, and work. While I do now have security, a job, can travel, and everything pretty much, that I was hoping for, I'm still severely unhappy.

While i am incredibly thankful to have income and shit during the pandemic where I know many people dont, it just makes me want to NOT have any of those things. I know, privilage, right? Wrong timing. I know life can be incredibly hard without paper and a box, but that is what makes it worthwhile, IMO.

I feel that I live two lives. On one hand, I'm the person you see on here. I ride, hitch, travel, try to fight for what I believe in, voice my opinions to the max, and try to make the world a better place for everyone, especially travelers.

On the other hand, I work for a government job. Which is awesome because of the nature of my work (not this one particularly, but for the most part) and it silences me in the utmost possible way. I have strict rules on what I can say and do to voice my opinion. I have 2 months before I can travel, and then I only get 3 months. I only have 2 days off a week, and I live in such a remote location, that does not allow me to go to any cities, do anything, or have any social interaction what so ever. I haven't been out traveling since almost a year ago. Its killing me.

When I was a 'seasonal' (6 months + off a year, no benefits at all) my life was so much more interesting. I was rappelling off of cliffs, riding in helicopters, fighting wildfires, proving emergency medical care, the works. Now I'm stuck in a box, working a cash register....all for medical insurance and retirement. Definitely considering going back to seasonal work. Mainly because I have a 'live today, die tomorrow' attitude.

I want to be in Portland participating in the protests, I want to be riding, I want to volunteer for FNB, I want to live out of a fucking backpack again. I want to fly a sign, I want to play my mandolin, I want to busk, I want to have time to develop myself in a personal manner with skills I can use to better myself.

Instead, in stuck in an a remote area, selling passes to people who ARE doing all of that on vacation. I've ran into so many travelers at our 'entrance gate' that have to turn around because they dont have the money to pay to get in. And I've seen WAY more rich ass Seattle buisness people who have no problem in doing so....

My question is, how do you deal? How do you deal with the negative press, all of the shit happenings in the country that are blasted all over the media? Especially if you are stuck like me, without being able to do the things you love most? ( I know I'm preaching to the choir during COVID)

I just feel like I'm dying inside. I'm getting so angry. My health is deteriorating (just had an ER visit due to Hypertension and 'obesity'), I'm drinking WAY too much to deal with it. I'm considering risking my whole career I've built over the past 10 years, and quitting my job to travel for a couple of years, clear my head.

....anyway. Rant over. Just wondering if anyone else is feeling the same, and any ideas on bettering mental health during these situations.


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## ali (Oct 5, 2020)

I'm not sure i can help much because the trigger for my last two "sabbaticals" has been political bullshit and not being able to cope with it all. My last straw in China was the crackdowns in Hong Kong and the arrests of citizen journalists and party critics that happened during the coronavirus lockdown. Most people don't get it. Maybe they don't identify with the groups facing oppression. Maybe they focus in on their own family and their own job because that's their raison d'être. But for me, i don't got a family and i resent every minute i have to work. Edge up the pressure outside and like you i get to drinking too much, obviously that doesn't help my health, then i crack and bug out.

Now i'm out of the country where the political situation was stressing me out but i still can't go anywhere. Winter is coming, border's closed. I got financial freedom because i saved a bunch to travel, but that's on hold because of this virus. I'm just renting a room in a quiet town, no belongings, no friends nearby, not much to do. I'm not having the experience i wanted, but i know for sure that getting out saved my mental health from a totally self-destructive spiral.

If you want a concrete suggestion, i would say if you are on social media or if you watch news on television, quit both of those things. You can still keep up-to-date by reading the paper, but that's far less sensationalized and there's not a constant blast of breathless panic and calls to action.

Aside from that, though, i don't have any good ideas. For me, work - and having to deal with the kind of rich jackasses you are dealing with - already puts my stress level at 90%, so when other things push it further, the best bang for buck is simply to quit working. I understand for people who don't have much money saved that's not really an option, but if it is an option, why not do it? You say leaving is risking your career... is it, though? Have you spoken candidly to your employer? Would you really not be able to come back? Even if that is the case, isn't a hiccup in your career still better than going down the bottle or ending up in the ER?

Anyway, i think the main thing i wanted to say is that i hear you, i feel you, you're not the only person who struggles with this sort of thing. Everyone has their own way of dealing, some do it better than others. Hopefully you'll get some tips more useful than mine that keep you rolling for a while, but i think if you're honest with yourself and recognize you gotta take a break, then that's what you gotta do.


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Oct 5, 2020)

I can definitely relate. I spent years working towards my career with the railroad. I worked on the ground as a switchman. I worked locals(short turn-around industry servicing trains) as a brakeman. I went on the road to work as a conductor from Bakersfield to West Colton/Long Beach. I transferred up to Roseville as a conductor to learn the territory while I had an open bid in on engine service class. I was awarded a seat in engine service class and had to make a very hard decision at that point.

When a conductor takes promotion into engine service he/she/they roll the dice. You have to pass all your tests and train simulator runs with 85% or better, otherwise you're fired. You don't get to go back to being a conductor if you fail, you're just fired. I made that leap and passed my classes. I ran the most demanding grade territory in North America and qualified there as a locomotive engineer. It was by no means an easy road I traveled to become an engineer.

I finally had it and I loved running trains. I worked out of Roseville 85-90 hours a week for years. I had no days off other than calling in sick and you can't do that too many times or you're fired. So I more or less worked about 29-30 days a month. Rare was it to work less than 12 hours a day. I had so much money I could buy a new car fully paid for in cash every other month if I wanted to. I wasn't happy at all.

I discovered people at the catch-out who befriended me and took me on a train hopping adventure which exposed the rawest form of freedom I'd ever experienced. I continued to work and transferred to Watsonville where I worked an extra board covering guys on their sick/vacation days working the locals they were assigned to. Basically like a substitute board of engineers. Those guys seldom called in sick and in the first few months I was there I only worked about 2 days a month on average.

I took a pay cut from Roseville wages but I still had a guarantee of over 8K a month to just be available and ready to work if they needed me. The next few months I worked one day in a 50 day stretch. Had another 40 something days off before I was called again. I had found the honey hole. I decided to ride freight trains out east, which led me to New Orleans. I was showing available and ready to work as far as the railroad knew but in reality I was drunk off my ass somewhere in the Bywater/French Quarter.

The thought of actually going back and working, even just one day every other month for 16k guarantee.. one day, two at the most.. for 16k and I just couldn't fucking do it. Talk about privilege. I don't even know how to explain it that well. I just felt like.. captive? I was chained to something. I even fucking loved the work, chained to something I enjoyed doing but it just wasn't bringing me real joy.

The money seemed so worthless to me. I look back now and feel like well.. you could have saved up and bought land you fucking moron but.. idk. I wonder if I would have been any happier even then? I just feel like we all have our own thresholds. We each have like a set amount of shit that we can endure. I feel like I exhausted whatever I had left in me back in Roseville. So even when I found the honey hole ideal job, no work and paid pretty good.. I just noped out on it.

I'm way fucking happier now. I don't have a whole lot of anything to my name in terms of possessions but I keep collecting new experiences. I feel like those experiences are worth so much more to me than any amount of money. What good is money if I gotta be somebody else's bitch for it? Even if only once every month or whatever.. it just felt awful having to forfeit my time, my energy, plans, whatever.. not even for a fucking day every now and then.

So I threw that shit away. What's funny is right now I'm actually working, for much much less than I made there and I definitely feel captive again and growing extremely unhappy but I know this isn't forever. It's an entirely different set of circumstances involving me taking care of a very ill mother and the state pays me to do it. It's something I'd be doing for free anyway, might as well get paid a little since I'm here. I know this is short lived though.

She won't be here too much longer. So I'm just trying to enjoy the time I have with her, and trying to help her stay as healthy as we can keep her to give her more years for herself. You hang around with someone who's dying, and have talks with them often. It really changes some of your perspective on what's really important. She's expressed many regrets, but I ain't heard her ever express regret for having left her career when she did.

I don't think we're supposed to be working for someone else. I mean obviously it would be hard to try and factory reset yourself into a hunter gatherer but I think the closer you can get to that, the more like a human you're gonna feel. Get off the clock, yanno? Obviously you know your situation a lot better than I do. I'm not saying "hey quit your job it's gonna be okay". I'm just offering my story and the moves I made when I felt a little bit like you. Do what you gotta do, for your own happiness. If you're miserable, what's the fucking point?


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## Deleted member 28239 (Oct 5, 2020)

I literally looked on here for the first time in awhile hoping to see if anyone else was having a shit time working and being housed up right now. Thank you for sharing, I feel like there isn't any real comfort or advice to give because things just fucking suck and there's no way around it. But acknowledging that it sucks has been getting me through way more than any false positivity bullshit.

I got lucky and found a job a few months ago. I get paid decent, I have a really nice little employee apartment, I'm in a beautiful area, it's by far the easiest housekeeping job I've had. I've always kinda dreamed of being able to afford a little studio apartment but now that I'm in one, all I do is drink and fight panic attacks and stare at the ants and garbage in my cozy little depression pit. There's an unexplored mountain in my backyard but I'm too burned out to do my dishes, let alone go hike.

The manager at my job has such a weird, moody, passive aggressive energy and I can't stand it. Like of you want me to do something just fucking tell me instead of giving weird little hints and suggestions. She'll do things like tell me in a very sweet voice that I don't *have* to take a full lunch, if I want to take a 15 minute one that's okay too. And then when I take my full lunch, because fuck that, and come back she's standoffish and weird. If you want me to do some stupid shit at least have the spine to be direct about it. It puts a weird mood on the entire day and drives me nuts. It feels like I spend the entire work day trying to figure out if she's mad about something or if I'm just being paranoid.

Oh, and the blatant disregard for any covid precautions makes me want to burn the entire place to the ground. My co-worker came in sick. Coughing, weak, congested, like obviously visibly sick. She continued to work. All day. Cleaning hotel rooms. Without a mask. Nobody wears a mask. Yesterday I was wearing one and a co-worker asked if it was because of the smoke???? Are you fucking serious??? Are you that fucking dense?? Do we just deserve this as a species????

And there's a million other reasons why my life has felt like a shitshow since last November that I won't get into.

I'm just at a point where I don't know what to do or where to go or what I want. I keep going back and forth on a million little plans and schemes and questioning and analyzing myself and trying to figure out what's best for me and the world but then I just stare at the ceiling and feel like my chest is being crushed by the weight of the brutal nothing. But I don't feel like I have any right to be this miserable when I'm in an objectively good place. 

Everyday I see rich fat white boomers on their Razrs flying Trump flags. The lobby TV is always playing Fox news. Every minute of every day is a big fat reminder of how profit and lies and selfishness and conspiracies are killing people. It feels hopeless. 

I just want to sit around a fire and eat some good food with some cool people and fall asleep on the ground and wake up reeking of palo verde smoke with nowhere to be.


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## roughdraft (Oct 5, 2020)

there's a lot that is simply outside of your control, I'd gradually swap out the drinking for yoga and light cardio, maybe some jogging, then focus on the bigger stuff like Can I cope with this job?

but if you're goin to the ER for hypertension, filling up on booze is only gonna keep hurting you, your personal prospects, and, in a subtle way, any MUCH bigger/political cause that gets your blood pumping

gotta look out for number one


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## NewMexicoJim (Oct 5, 2020)

Coywolf, as you can see, you aren't alone, almost everyone is suffering now for one reason or another. I have at least a half dozen stories of my own where I am struggling to have a life with meaning. One in particular strikes me as quite similar. 

In '98, I was working in the PNW at Mt St Helens National Monument, in charge of ticket sales on the south end of the monument in a remote location. The USFS had handed the job of ticket sales over to the cooperating association which in most parks would sell only books, maps, etc. I had come there from Flagstaff, AZ thinking it was a good career move and a great chance to explore the PNW. Boy was I wrong. The job lasted all of 6 months before I quit. Money or tickets or both kept flying out the window and our operation was coming up short by hundreds of dollars daily. I was supervising my own staff of 8 plus seasonal interpreters with USFS whom I had no real control over. We had 3 sales outlets, no cash registers, no phones and I had to drive 80 miles round trip, by myself, every week to deposit thousands of dollars. My boss just kept telling me everything was fine but I knew if/when the shit hit the fan, all fingers would point to me. So, I wrote a long letter to the Assistant Superintendent and my boss and quit my job. 

I was more than miserable. I don't consider myself a quitter and I really had hoped for a much different experience in such a beautiful location. I finally had to admit to myself that it was just not the job for me and I wasn't willing to risk my reputation or jail for some yahoos who couldn't count or were just plain stealing. 

The next two jobs lead to two heart attacks because managing people sucks and the company only wants profits so being a manager=being the bad guy. Great jobs, I thought, just not great for me it turned out. 

Was that the end? Hell no. New Mexico had it's pitfalls too. Turns out most jobs are shitty and few of us are able to find that balance where we love going to work most days and we just do it because we have to. After another heart attack and a bunch of soul searching, I am now on disability. The pay is shitty but I have good health care, no boss, no cubicle, no stress. With back pay, I bought a truck and camper and do as I wish within my financial limits.

Is my life great now? Well, my dreams of youth have given way to the acceptance of ageing and the limitations that brings. I'm disappointed I wasted so much time looking in the wrong places and wrong people for happiness. We all need money but chasing a buck for it's own sake is a soul killer. Now I get to live in the Gila and camp, hike, fish, photograph or just get stoned off my ass if that's what I want. Booze has lost nearly all it's appeal and a good bowl of primo puts my focus where it belongs, in and around nature. I do miss close friends but do not miss people much. I'm not a joiner nor do I fight the big battles any more. I do what I can in my own small way as often as I can and am satisfied with that. 

Funny how life happens in ways we least expect. Joseph Campbell once wrote that sometimes we have to give up the life we had planned to have the life that's been waiting for us. That surely is true by my experience. I have a feeling it's true for most of us.


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## Coywolf (Oct 5, 2020)

ali said:


> You say leaving is risking your career... is it, though? Have you spoken candidly to your employer? Would you really not be able to come back?



Getting into my career field is INCREDIBLY difficult, and I had to bust my ass, sacrifice alot, and really work the system to get in in the first place. So, I'm pretty worried about taking a hiatus, as the rest of the people who want the jobs I want continue to work towards them.

But no. It's not a total deal breaker. I kind of want to work in Wildland Fire instead of what ik doing now anyway, so I may have to quit to get a different job.



ali said:


> Anyway, i think the main thing i wanted to say is that i hear you, i feel you, you're not the only person who struggles with this sort of thing.



Thank you, I really appreciated you response. I really do feel like in preaching to the choir here, but I had to hear from someone else to, just to see if I am being a complete whiny ass.



Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> I'm way fucking happier now. I don't have a whole lot of anything to my name in terms of possessions but I keep collecting new experiences.



Bingo. I am approaching the point of all of the things I own not being able to fit into my vehicle, and that has been a hard rule for me for a decade. And ya, EXPERIENCES mean sooo, oh so much more, to me than possessions. As long as I have my vehicle, travel gear, and instrument, books, camping/survival gear...I'm good.

The last time I was out traveling, I changed...or more of the fact that I was revived back to my true self. When I go back and look at myself on my YT videos from last year, I'm fucking happy. I could have been THE happiest person on earth, and I'm not exaggerating that whatsoever.

Even talking to a girlfriend last year, when she asked what hobby I enjoyed most....I opened up about riding freight, which I do VERY rarely to people who arent in this culture. After I finished she just said, 

'wow...you just completely changed as a person while you were talking about trains. Your eyes got brighter and I swear to god I could see you 'aura' brighten. That really makes you happy, doesnt it?' 



Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> I feel like those experiences are worth so much more to me than any amount of money.



#HeartEmoji 



Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> If you're miserable, what's the fucking point?



This. This is the question I ask myself every day. This may be one of only a few times in my life where i have been completely and totally miserable. I'm so miserable that I cant enjoy the SPECTACULAR area I live in. I live in a fucking rainforest. In a national park. The ocean is a 45 minute drive. Yet the 2 days off I have a week is not enough time to get out and see anything, because I am so damn remote.



Yody said:


> But acknowledging that it sucks has been getting me through way more than any false positivity bullshit.



This. This is kind of what I was trying to do here. Everyone keeps throwing out that fake positivity BS since COVID started. It makes me cringe. I've been trying to do wellness podcasts and positive thinking/meditation. It feels SO fake to me. It's just telling me 'stop paying attention to the bad things, and they will go away'. Me, being pretty opinionated about changing negative aspects of society will not let myself do that, even if I wanted to.

I could go to therapy, i guess. I have the insurance for it. But its SUCH a hassle. I have to drive 1.5 hours to get somewhere, and that's IF they have anyone taking patients, which is hard to find in this area. But it would probably be beneficial.



Yody said:


> all I do is drink and fight panic attacks



Yep. Hear that.



Yody said:


> There's an unexplored mountain in my backyard but I'm too burned out to do my dishes, let alone go hike.



Ya....this is a huge problem with me. I'm at the stage of depression where I feel totally helpless, and dont want to do anything but lay in my bed during my days off. I dont even want to drive to Aberdeen to watch the trains and tag the yard. Something that brings me immense joy.



Yody said:


> But I don't feel like I have any right to be this miserable when I'm in an objectively good place.



This is also my thought. I feel like I'm just being a total pansy, and I need to suck it up, because I am pretty fucking well off compared to so many other people , especially during the pandemic. I feel like I dont have the 'right' to be this depressed/sad/angry. But that doesnt make it any better, because then I just get pissed at myself for being such an unstable person. So it's like, a black hole of thought.



Yody said:


> I just want to sit around a fire and eat some good food with some cool people and fall asleep on the ground and wake up reeking of palo verde smoke with nowhere to be.



The 2018 Jamboree in slabs just flashed before my eyes as I was reading this, and I honestly shed tears. That was one of the happiest times of my life. Riding almost 2,000 miles to get down there, and hanging out with bad ass people. Not a care in the world. I would give everything for that feeling again.



NewMexicoJim said:


> Joseph Campbell once wrote that sometimes we have to give up the life we had planned to have the life that's been waiting for us.



Jim, I've been really enjoying your posts. They have made me miss the southwest (my hometown is Flagstaff) immensely. That quote is very inspiring, and reading it stimulates the philosophical part of my brain that tells me, 'hey man, you ain't trapped. It's your life. Do what makes you happy'. And also, for some reason, 

*Que Michael Bolton*

"Life Is a pussy, just waiting to get fuuuuuuuuucked!"


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## croc (Oct 5, 2020)

In my professional opinion.... QUIT UR JOB AND DO WHAT MAKES U HAPPY! Ur health now isn't worth the hope of retirement later.


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Oct 5, 2020)

Just a quick note on "the hassles of driving an hour and a half to see a therapist, that is if they're even seeing anyone right now" you might wanna make a call or two, if you do want to seek therapy. As far as I know from my ex and also one of my kids, they're doing video chat via cell phone therapy. You might be able to chill in your van, drive only to a point of good reception and do the damn thing in the comfort of your van.


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## Desperado Deluxe (Oct 6, 2020)

Honestly you should work till you can acquire assets that will generate enough to live how you please. Save money now that you have that kinda job. Dont put all your eggs in one basket. 
Seriously dedicate all your time to doing something productive. Start a business or get into making more yt vids when your out hopping. Do some research on getting started in doing something else on the side. Watch videos at work or whatever.
Just my .2$


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## snailormoon (Oct 8, 2020)

I feel this hard, dude. And I also feel for you. While I've never had the experience of putting that many years into a career (the only career I've ever had was 3 years, though it sucked the life out of me) I understand where you're coming from. 

It feels like shit to get to a certain point and realize that all the work you put into something still hasn't reaped the exact reward you're looking for: happiness, or at least some goddamn contentedness! 
In my experience, which is very little in comparison, the stability that I've always sought in jobs, relationships, material things, etc. has always been more about finding that stability and balance within myself. Which ya know, I still haven't found. 

Using those things as a substitute eventually renders me depressed as fuck and unable to function. Lately alcohol has definitely been a part of it for me, too. I used to drink about twice a week. Now I'm getting drunk every night (and sometimes day.) 
Fucked up how we indulge in a depressant in an attempt to quell depression! 

-------------------------------------------------------

Don't get me wrong, I'm no wise sage who can tell ya how I kicked mental illness's butt and lived to tell the tale. It's still a constant struggle.

I feel like putting all that I have into a job and neglecting my own wants and needs has satisfied me short-term and given me something to stay busy with. When I go balls to the wall and work my ass off for something, and start to see results, it's like, hell yeah! But then... stagnation. And then helplessness from feeling unproductive.

The problem that always comes with this is a tendency to neglect my own health, mentally and physically, to a point of total loss of self and as a result, hospitalization. Being raised in a very capitalist and catholic household-the worship of the christian god and the worship of money is pretty much the same to me at this point- has definitely instilled a guilt within me to be useful to others (or a higher power) and to generate capital, lest I be deemed a loser. 


----------------------------------------------------
"Your meaning in this life is directly related to how useful you are to others." -an actual fucked up quote from my dad lol

It's been a struggle to break away from that ideology. I'm still working on it. 

The road does make it easier for me to function mentally, for sure. Not worrying about the many facets of living that "traditional life" is a breath of fresh air. I think that the two things can coexist for sure! In fact, I am housed up and paying rent as we speak lol. From what you're saying, it sounds like being a seasonal wildland firefighter and traveling in the off season has been a good balance.

I don't think that what you're saying comes from a place of privilege. I think it comes from a place of knowing the things that make you happy. As someone of privilege (I'm a white girl from the suburbs) I understand what you're saying, though.

---------------------------

It's always been easiest for me to pretend that I'm okay. I commend the fuck outta you for expressing these things and admitting that you're not. 

My heart hurts for you, but I also know that the things you're going through can also become a kick in the ass to change what you hate about your situation. At least within my life, change has occurred when the pain of staying the same is greater than the discomfort of changing. 

Depression is a crippling bitch, but I feel like from what I know about you, you're a strong motherfucker. Hang in there, friendo. 


Damn, sorry this is long as fuck...and all over the place. I haven't seen my therapist in a minute hahaa 

---slime out---


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## chrislaw (Oct 9, 2020)

Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> Do what you gotta do, for your own happiness. If you're miserable, what's the fucking point?





Yody said:


> Every minute of every day is a big fat reminder of how profit and lies and selfishness and conspiracies are killing people. It feels hopeless.
> 
> I just want to sit around a fire and eat some good food with some cool people and fall asleep on the ground and wake up reeking of palo verde smoke with nowhere to be.





NewMexicoJim said:


> I'm disappointed I wasted so much time looking in the wrong places and wrong people for happiness.



You guys. I resonate and relate so much that I really have very little to add. (this forum software is kickass though, I resent how hard it is to multi-quote on literally every other forum I'm on) 

Does it matter that someone basically completely unknown to ourselves feels similarly about a lot of aspects of life? I guess it's a bit reassuring - "I'm not the only one losing my fucking mind here" type thing ... but what I love most about it is how it calls back to the greatest experiences of my life (when I've been free) ... we are one, as overused a cliche as that is. 

Not that that really moves the dial much when one has to get up, after disturbed and very little sleep, to go to a job you hate yourself for doing... Anyway ... love 2 all of you


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## Beegod Santana (Oct 9, 2020)

Dude if you're working a cash register and it's literally causing you health problems it's time to move on.


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## Fritz (Oct 10, 2020)

Don't have much to add except that I've been reading through this thread & have found a wealth of information and comfort in everyone's perspectives. I'm glad you started this thread Coywolf. I'm not joking or being sarcastic when I say that reading these responses are better than some self help podcasts I've listened to. Not to go off on a tangent but a lot of "self help" media is geared towards making you a more "efficient" or productive worker drone as so you can live a cookie cutter life -one size fits all...to hell with that noise. Coywolf, I don't know you, and I definitely don't want to put words in your mouth but you sound like you know exactly what you want to do but you're still asking yourself permission. In my opinion, my own feelings as of late- the ratio of uncertainty with society is matched with my personal uncertainty and it's suffocating, if that makes any sense. It's like "why look at a calendar when everyday is the same ?" And how I try to shake out of that is by making plans. Some plans may be obtainable, some may not. I'm planning on hiking the Appalachian Trail. I'm the kind of person that has to have a carrot on the end of a stick and more often than not that carrot is freedom and not material goods. I'm working a crappy warehouse job at the moment and have worked my fair share of crappy jobs and as soon as I take on a job, as soon as I get hired I'm thinking "okay, what am I'm trying to achieve...a big or bigger tv every couple of years ?, upgrade my phone ? a new car ? -that I'll drive (collectively) maybe 3 hours a week but will pay four to five years on ? ,etc. .etc." A couple of months back I landed a job at a meat processing plant that specialized in pepperoni and I did an interview with this guy who was nice enough, and we conversed back and forth and he was forthright with me in confessing that the company had just recently gotten rid of some toxic employees and he said something that I agreed with but only because it was sadly true, he said "it's important to get along with your co-workers because we spend more time with them than our families." That's very true...and that's very screwed up to say the least. I lasted two days at that job, not because of that man's philosophy that I reluctantly agreed with but because sliding around on a bloody floor all day and spending the last two hours of an already grueling day cleaning equipment started killing my soul quicker than I'd guess. Now I run a forklift and load soaps & scented candles on and off of trucks, sometimes working the line. Glamorous ! But I'm working for the trail. More money, more miles.

Again, I just want to reiterate, how appreciative I am of this thread and all the responses. Shit is sideways right now to say the least and my hat goes off to everyone grinding it out. I'm gonna bounce before I get too sappy, lol. Toodles, safe travels, and I sincerely wish you the best because I'm a big fan of anyone who realizes , what's that Jiddu Krishnamurti quote ? - "_It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."_


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## Deleted member 28591 (Oct 10, 2020)

On the bright side, self censorship as an occupational requirement in salaried positions with major corporations is fast becoming the norm, so that issue will probably follow you around


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## Johny (Oct 10, 2020)

I'm 40 , was put in foster care and group homes when I was 7 .
My mom went to prison and my dad died in 96 , both my mom and dad were ex military , bikers and cross country truckers .
I learned to read a map and to read before I started school.
But also there was this constant undertone of extreme violence .
Like so much so i thought it was normal.
Idk I'm drunk and severely antisocial.....


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## Buzzkill (Oct 20, 2020)

Hey, I'm going through something similar. Not quite the same, but basically - I'm trying to do what I have to do get housed up and stay that way awhile, for financial reasons, and also for my long term survival in terms of a medical condition I struggle with. My mental health is deterioating badly for in a large part, the same reasons. Its killing me. I spent part of the summer suicidal. And similarly, I told myself for years stay cool and follow the path - once you actually get a "permanent" housing situation, it'll be worth it, you'll have a chance - this shit will clear up, it'll b e ok. Get out of the shit your in, that will solve that, it will be over.
Yeah - exact problem you mentioned. That's not what happened. the shit didn't end, this didn't solve things, was not the turning point it was supposed to be

I feel you. I think we come from different pasts though

I was taught Edward Abbey "Sentiment without action is ruination of the soul"

I am, if nothing else, a devout social justice person, and activist
That being said, I've had to put that down for a few years, especially where I now live, which is "safer" for a "disabled" person

I spent most of the past three years offline. I got ahold of a used computer and an internet connection last week, and have spent pretty much every waking minute online. Some of that was catching up on personal business, important, som eofit financial, etc But i find most of my time reading alternative media and on forums with like minded peers, people who travel, free spirits, poor people from disadvantage, and people who give a fuck, and rebels. People who assert there independence and stand up, one way or another... personally, or socially. Also, people who love the outdoors and living close to nature, sustainably, naturally, humanely, wildly, honestly. etc. healthfully

I dont even have any computer system speaker or anything so am greatly missing audio (and video becomes mostly useless)

I knew I would b e tempted to spend too much time. I tried to reign it in. I know me, i was worried i would lose 72 hours straight. Its been 5 days. the third day, all I stopped to eat was 2 eggs and water......

i worry what's going on with me. I think, i'm compulsive in a b ad way or something. Am i addicted?

but today, the fifth day - I'm smiling. Alot. I dont remember smiling like this in years. I'm happy.....

its sad what i've deterioated to, b ut its no surprise someone what I've b een through

I'm not a sell out. But I'm trying to learn to do what I have to do as an individual with severe medical problems in the US, without family support or significant financial resources. I'm trying to learn be an adult, a citizen. Fight for a legal, just system - and find my own place, and justice recipient in it. Navigate the heinous structure we have inherited. Good luck!


For me, I was taught - a spiritual solution. A spiritual perspective. I try and bring myself b ack to this. I want to study more. One of the graces of internet access is i can find spiritual teachers and teachings. This is wonderful for me

I try and find my role in the situation. I talk, think, study what others say. The political situation is heinous.

One thing that helped me a few years b ack, when i still had internet, a man who had gone to seminary and become a minister, and then gone on (missionary?) work in the farthest reaches of canada in native reservations, only to finally face coming out as gay - and be ex-communicated, he taught me that in early Christian times in the roman empire - Romans would often throw unwanted babies from unwanted pregnancies into the dump, still alive..

(modern people occasionally do this too, and sometimes get caught, but rampant then..)

Early Christians would go to the dump and rescue these children and take them in and raise them.

Pretty soon most Romans were talking shit ab out them

They said, and spread vast rumors that these Christians were eating the babies, and commiting cannibalism.

Then they said they were raping the babies, and keeping the children for sex slavery.

And amongst all the heinous persecution in those times, the Christians kept going to the dump and rescuing babies, and taken them in and providing and caring for them.

This really helped me. a perspective. What people went through in history, compared to now - and all the lies that the historical problems are solved, and (as Candide) We live in the best of all possible worlds, with the best governments in history, the best democracy ever, etc. etc. etc.

What can we expect of life? a levittown house, 4 door cadillac family mobile? leave it to beaver nuclear family? no, that is lies, propaganda and bbullshit

I hear "Rewild or die" and I give credit to it. But, i belive in "The Rule Of Law, and Not Of Men"

without law, and a legal system, legislation, courts, a justice system, it becomes gangster - individual persons then "make right" and determine "power. " it becomes a game of power and strong man, then bully, and warlord. Only by uniting all the "little guys" and using that power of Unity, can w e counter the power of bully, mob leader, gangster and warlord, etc. And we have to organize that power to keep it safe and make it work. The way to do that is law - I believe in the Rule of Law, and not of _Men_.

So i try to learn my place in that. We have to have a social SYSTEM. I am responsible for informing and educating myself how to make it work properly, care for it, take share. Informing myself appropriately, being knowledgable. Basic citizenship. Then what else can I do to care for it? the social system we NEED to not live as oppressed persons and slaves, from bully and warlord.

I taught myself survival and preparedness, I study sustainability, TRUE sustainability. I study health

and I know i need support. Worse then being alone perhaps, is being surrounded by toxic people. selfish people, irrseponsible, who dont care. I am surrounded 

People are pack animals - not just to hunt, live together and defend our housing and crops, and resource - but our minds are that way as well. "The Socioligical Mirror" We do not KNOW ourselves from our own perspective - we cannot perceive ourselves from our own mind, just as we cannot see our own face - without a mirror. We know ourselves from the REACTIONS of the people around us - their expressed perspectives. Our self -esteem, self - confidence, everything - comes from THAT. Social EXPERIENCE.

We NEED socializing. and positive. That's SURVIVAL

Humans who were ticking off or constantly disappointing or otherwise not social functing with the group, did not survive.
This is evolution - how our brains evolved
Those who survived - collaborated successfully with a group of humans - and got postive reinforcement as a result. So, we are wired to check for it - and adapt to it - to survive.

So - our individual survival, and health, not just Physical, but MENTAL, depends completely on the survival of our fellow humans - our group, pack. If the people arround us are all dying, we die too. If they are all phsycially ill, we become physically ill too. If they are mentally unfit or unhealthy, we become unhealthy too. We are not completely individual, and cannot be. We are group creatures, not just in function and interaction, but in our very selves - in our minds. We cannot exist in our minds, without others.

A psychologist once snapped at me "have me show you the most mentally unhealthy person, and I will show you the hermit"

It's true. I love nature and quiet and peace. I have severe PTSD and trauma, i prefer it to the company of most humans, most of the time. I would be a great candidate for a job like yours. Its good for people like me, who would rather just sit and drink nature and commune all weekend, than go to a city.... i can't stand bars or coffee shops or the like anymore. I've had it...

but I've learned my lesson camping by myself off where its free and "safer", away from town. extended periods - i get lonely, i need someone to talk to. One time for 6 months, camping alone i had no internet access ever. that was hardest on the isolation, and wore on my mental health and stress. Nothing helps stress, like good socializing! Its well known. I decided i would make the most of my social interactions. When I had to make a monthly phone call to pay a b ill, I would pay more attention to the person I talked to. I would make the most of the interaction, instead of just politely doing business and moving on. It was funny because i usually got the same person and they came to recognize me well and know me over the months. Fortunately they were a nice person! it helped. B ut it was not enough, and i decided in this day and age, its very very hard to get by without internet anymore, just like a phone... society is no longer set up for it.

You have clearly learned, and mastered, many of the quick fixes - don't have the resources? Hop a train illegally for free! tough it out and brute force solution. Political ab use - protest in the street! If nothing else it, makes us feel better. Action! short term changes...... But you have seen already you need more to be sustainable, and worked towards a better career situation and opportunity, and resouces. But it is difficult to manage! Welcome to the show. Design a perfect society, i dare you - no one has and no one will. Becaues that's not the world. The world is struggling to barely survive history, and was struggling to barely survive then. The IMF says 250 million people worldwide are due to starve to this new recession dip from the COVID closures. That's real man. That's the world. Solve that, then we can solve "retirement plans". That's how the world works - its wild.

Step up your game. Grow, provide for yourself. You have accomplished so m uch - dont try and rest on laurels - keep working. Mr. Nearing worked every day until he was 100 years old, and then decided that was enough and basically stopped eating until he died. Provide for yourself - go further. Beyond street protest - step up the game further, more advanced. Beyond hopping trains to get into nature and have mobility etc, - step up your game further, and more advanced. And join what adults have been doing for millenia - trying to live, survive, and build a life for themselves and their people in community and society - surviving as pack animals that left the ape stage of completely wild, overpopulated and is endurng the pandoras box of all the strange things that it means to be human as we learn to find a way to balance it all and make it sustainble.

You only live once. Make it worthwhile

Why stay in the youth perspective of live today, die tomorrw?

Step up - go more advanced. Start trying to have Live Today, try to find a way to Live Tomorrow, perhaps die soon enough afterwards. You've mastered live today - can you make it live 2 days? a week? a month - can you master it and provide for yourself for years, and then enough you could provide as an elder, a father, for the next generation too?

It's good to talk. We all need to talk, so much, and we all live in so much silence. Take care!


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## Johny (Oct 20, 2020)

Im dying inside and completely antisocial .
Still cant find what I'm looking for...


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Oct 21, 2020)

Buzzkill said:


> I spent most of the past three years offline. I got ahold of a used computer and an internet connection last week, and have spent pretty much every waking minute online





Buzzkill said:


> I dont even have any computer system speaker or anything so am greatly missing audio (and video becomes mostly useless)



Pick some speakers from this list and lemme know which ones you want. Send me a DM with your contact/mailing instructions and I'll get them for you. Music is extremely important (at least to me) and I feel like it can help tremendously when you're struggling with mental health obstacles. I spend a lot of time online too and I just can't imagine not having sound, I feel for ya.


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## Hudson (Oct 21, 2020)

I hear you man, I think alot of people do. I'm seeking help from the VA for the first time in 15 years, i want out of the ptsd cycle I have been in since Iraq. I blow my life up every two years. And for some reason, this time around, it is just too much. Lost my career from a work injury, abandoned school because of the dissolvation of my only meaningful relationship, my housing, and now I see my dead platoon sergeant on the corners of my vision. Dude died in my lap in iraq, and I guess its finally coming to a head in my mind these last two weeks.

I got money saved (hooray), but no plan for the future and not a whole lot of hope. Im hoping the va can give me some kind of therapy to deal with this ghost shit in my life. Im so tired of the 2 year cycle.

The only advice I can give is to do your best to keep yourself moving forward. Don't succumb to drugs or alcohol, do not hurt yourself. Depression is a bitch when it hits, and its usually a seasonal thing.


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## Johny (Oct 21, 2020)

I been dealing with PTSD , extreme anxiety , depression and intermittent explosive disorder most my life wich results in some pretty extreme anti social behavior , awkward situations and loss of jobs and relationships .
For quite a few years I was like a " murder magnet " and everywhere I went I just happened to be in the right place at the wrong time .
For instance I was in vegas for the mass shooting , then at three different gas stations on north vegas Blvd i witnessed two shootings and a man beat to death with a claw hammer within a two week period , hopped out to salt lake city and was with a friend at a tire shop in Murray Utah stepped out back just in time to see a guy get shot twice in the head in his car slump over his stearing wheel and hit the accelerator plowing through on coming traffic causing a 6 car pile up with fatalities.
....so yeah I get pretty lost in my head with music.
I recently moved in with a girl had a kid and been having a hard time keeping a job because I "snap" , but have a Jackson guitar and a coworker relized I didnt have an amp and sold me a Marshall halfstack for $150 wich 2 weeks later I traded for a smaller 30 watt marshall practice amp and a 1993 gibson les paul studio .
Ive basically been occupying my mind by plating this les paul and trting to figure out guitar , otherwise my mind is a constant racing mess and stress overwhelmingly destroys my life.
I feel like the key for me was to keep moving and now that I'm not doing that I need something to completely focus on.
Oddly enough playing guitar and video games are help me focus my mind and keep my hands doing something.
Wich i never thought at 40 I would become a gamer but hey I'm not a constant angry troll under a bridge trting to drowned out rage with a vodka or wild turkey bottle anymore and I can actually walk through a walmart without watching everyone and being hyper vigilant and or paranoid everyone in the world is watching me.
Still sit facing the door back to the wall EVERYWHERE I go , and normally know all the exits when I'm inside , but not having reacurring nighmares and trouble sleep anymore .
I'm still extremely awkward in social situations , but can actually hold a conversation , its taken me 3 years to get where I actually dont mind talking to ppl I dont know and dont try to avoid human contact.


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## JohnnyTW (Oct 24, 2020)

Such a great thread. Appreciate everyone's posts here. I've also struggled with looking for contentment or happiness in certain career paths or relationships, and never really had the guts to stick to any of it, or to stick to the lifestyle of permanent travel/itinerant worker that I've always dreamed of. I fucking hate working full time because I never have energy for anything else, I drink too much, I become impatient and resentful in relationships, and the projects I really want to work on go by the wayside while I make my boss and landlord rich. I thought that would change once I found the right career but eventually I realized it never will. What I truly love is making music, travelling and learning new things. Right now I'm working full time to pay off some debt and save for a small RV. I always wanted to change the world but I think have realized the gravity of creation and the idea of being able to change things seems incredibly naive. This universe is fucking mind blowing. DNA is powerful. Psychedelics really helped me to understand this. I realize that culture and technology evolves incrementally over time the same way that organisms do, and I hope that it bends towards justice and I will do what I can to play my part in that. I've realized my mental and physical limitations and so I will focus on what my abilities allow and try not to carry the weight of every injustice on my shoulders. I find I don't do well on my own, but also find it hard to meet new people--a catch 22 when it comes to travelling. So I have been trying to develop the mental resilience it takes to be on the road long term by myself. I think I have come a long way since my last bout of travelling, but now of course covid has struck and in the interim I was diagnosed with Crohn's which definitely makes travel much more difficult. My plan is to work through another Ontario winter and by the summer maybe head out west and get back to nature. I feel like my soul has been crushed and the things I loved about travelling and camping are out of my mental reach now. Maybe because of depression, work, pessimism, the political situation? I don't know. But I'm not willing to give up and die slowly working in some factory every day. I have to get it back and do the work I was really meant to do. Sorry if this was a little all over the place. Best of luck to everyone!

PS: I agree generally with the live today, die tomorrow sentiment. Lately it's been a question of whether to settle down permanently (the opportunity is there) and try to make a living building furniture, which is rewarding enough but not my passion, or to embrace the adventures I still want to have and to do work that I feel will be more beneficial (research on OCD, teaching, volunteering) to other humans. If that means I stay poor the rest of my life then so be it. I'd rather not die in a hospital bed.


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## Buzzkill (Oct 27, 2020)

Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> Pick some speakers from this list and lemme know which ones you want. Send me a DM with your contact/mailing instructions and I'll get them for you. Music is extremely important (at least to me) and I feel like it can help tremendously when you're struggling with mental health obstacles. I spend a lot of time online too and I just can't imagine not having sound, I feel for ya.



Thank you _so_ much!! I really appreciate your generosity!!

I'm so sorry I didn't find this message sooner! If you're still up for it, I would really love to have speakers! I tried to send you a DM with a link to one of the and now the forum software is mad at me, and says "Your content can not be submitted. This is likely because your content is spam-like or contains inappropriate elements. Please change your content or try again later. If you still have problems, please contact an administrator." I took the link out but I still get the message LOL I dunno what I did or what to do LOL. Maybe it doesn't like my address? I dunno! I guess I'll try again later? Thank you!! 


P.S. How are we supposed to stay sane without music?  Thanks!!


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## Eng JR Lupo RV323 (Oct 27, 2020)

Hecks yeah I'm still down. I'm on a road trip right now to Seattle. Should get there late tonight. I'll order it when I get settled in. Just copy the link to the item and past it here in this post, that should work. Or type the item name exactly as it is and I'll find it and get it on order. Then just DM me your shipping instructions.


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## Coywolf (Oct 27, 2020)

Johny said:


> For instance I was in vegas for the mass shooting , then at three different gas stations on north vegas Blvd i witnessed two shootings and a man beat to death with a claw hammer within a two week period , hopped out to salt lake city and was with a friend at a tire shop in Murray Utah stepped out back just in time to see a guy get shot twice in the head in his car slump over his stearing wheel and hit the accelerator plowing through on coming traffic causing a 6 car pile up with fatalities.



Jesus, man...that is an incredible amount of violence to experience. 



Johny said:


> Oddly enough playing guitar and video games are help me focus my mind and keep my hands doing something.



I feel this, playing music is a very positive influence in my life. It also plays into the faith system I am starting to follow, Druidry/Paganism, and the Bardic aspect was a huge draw to me.



Johny said:


> Wich i never thought at 40 I would become a gamer but hey I'm not a constant angry troll under a bridge trting to drowned out rage with a vodka or wild turkey bottle anymore and I can actually walk through a walmart without watching everyone and being hyper vigilant and or paranoid everyone in the world is watching me.



Absolutely. I find myself becoming more angry/paranoid/anti social. Travelling has helped with with, every chance I get. I am forced to talk to people, and the more I do, the more I find positive experiences. It's almost as I have forgotten that people can ALSO be nice/friendly...the social media aspect of my life has skewed that perception. Keep reminding myself to just chill out, and not go down the paranoia spiral.



Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> Hecks yeah I'm still down. I'm on a road trip right now to Seattle. Should get there late tonight. I'll order it when I get settled in. Just copy the link to the item and past it here in this post, that should work. Or type the item name exactly as it is and I'll find it and get it on order. Then just DM me your shipping instructions.



This is so awesome. Today's patron saint of travel, much?


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## Buzzkill (Oct 29, 2020)

Eng JR Lupo RV323 said:


> Hecks yeah I'm still down. I'm on a road trip right now to Seattle. Should get there late tonight. I'll order it when I get settled in. Just copy the link to the item and past it here in this post, that should work. Or type the item name exactly as it is and I'll find it and get it on order. Then just DM me your shipping instructions.


Thank you so much!!!!   These look really awsome: Amazon.com: Logitech S150 USB Speakers with Digital Sound: Electronics - https://www.amazon.com/Logitech-S150-Speakers-Digital-Sound/dp/B000ZH98LU/ref=sr_1_23?dchild=1&keywords=computer+speakers&nav_sdd=aps&pd_rd_r=f465eaa9-e93f-4d62-b34c-1f02ab8b9283&pd_rd_w=kdUhy&pd_rd_wg=CHdoI&pf_rd_p=f8813af5-8d61-4988-b701-57bd7e498604&pf_rd_r=2T3BSK9ZQF1J8XSEVYGW&qid=1603273208&refinements=p_36%3A1253503011%2Cp_85%3A2470955011&rnid=2470954011&rps=1&s=electronics&sr=1-23 i hope that link works!  Logitech S150  Thank you so much!!!!!  Take care!!


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## EphemeralStick (Nov 8, 2020)

My boss asked me a few weeks ago if I wanted to be a chef. Pretty typical question when you're working in a kitchen I suppose but that led the conversation to him just asking what it is that I'm working towards. The only answer I could give him was peace.

Maintaining my mental health has felt like walking a tight rope across a very large, very deep canyon lately; with just one small misstep I feel like I could fall into the pit and not be able to get my way back out.

Whenever I feel overwhelmed by working during the pandemic I do the same thing you do; remind myself how fortunate I am that I still have something. Though personally, that sentiment usually makes me feel worse. Then, when I'm feeling low, I isolate myself from everyone I care about.



Coywolf said:


> I feel that I live two lives.



I've been feeling this way for months now, however I feel like one of my lives is starting to slip away. The people I work with and the new friends I've made, they only see me as the hardworking, polite and sober Andie. I often forget how weird my life sounds to some people and that makes it hard for me to open up or relate to them. I don't know why but they see me as fragile in their world, like because of my struggles I can't handle regular stress.

On the opposite side of the coin, they've never seen the badass, take care of everyone, drive you wherever you need to go, nomad Andie. The one that most people who've met me on here are familiar with. That's the version of me that feels like it's slipping away. 

Now before anyone chimes in and tells me to quit my job, I'm actually working towards something. I have goals in mind and a life that I envision myself with, the unfortunate reality is that I need money to do that. So while I would love to get back on the road, now just isn't the time.

That said, I am looking for new work now. I'm tired of working in the restaurant industry during this pandemic. I'm tired of the stress and dealing with people. I know that I have a strong work ethic and skills that I can take to pretty much any job. I need to get back to working with nature. In a nursery, maybe janitorial for the museums, heck I'm half tempted to make a craigslist ad offering my services as a freelance gardener. 

I guess that's my best advice. Keep working and doing the things you do, but change the work that you're doing. I know I'll never be the person who has the cake and eats it too, so I'll just have to keep making small adjustments to my life to get me to the place I'm trying to get to.


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## Coywolf (Nov 9, 2020)

EphemeralStick said:


> I guess that's my best advice. Keep working and doing the things you do, but change the work that you're doing. I know I'll never be the person who has the cake and eats it too, so I'll just have to keep making small adjustments to my life to get me to the place I'm trying to get to.



I like it. Thank you for the response, I relate to alot of the same issues.

The whole 'change the work you are doing' really stuck with me...this is the first time in a while where I havent absolutely LOVED my job, and I realized that was the only thing that was keeping me working...at all. Now I just dont want to, but know that I am too, also working towards something, and that I have to.

I am applying for new positions on the daily, and I know I will find something I love to do again soon....I might switch fields though...go into firefighting or maintenance or something...somewhere where you are not In the public limelight, and its alot easier to balance my '2 lives' than having to be clean cut, PC, government official talking to people in a box.



EphemeralStick said:


> The people I work with and the new friends I've made, they only see me as the hardworking, polite and sober Andie. I often forget how weird my life sounds to some people and that makes it hard for me to open up or relate to them.



Precisely! I opened up to a couple people in my last job of what I do when I'm not at work.

One was cool, but the others were like A: I never would have seen you doing that, and B: your fucking insane....lol It does make it EXTREMELY hard to relate to anyone. 

All they want to do is talk about how well their stocks are doing, their families, or what house they wanna buy....and I'm sitting over in the corner like, 'who ARE these people?!?!'



EphemeralStick said:


> On the opposite side of the coin, they've never seen the badass, take care of everyone, drive you wherever you need to go, nomad Andie. The one that most people who've met me on here are familiar with. That's the version of me that feels like it's slipping away.




See, I feel like I am becoming the opposite of those right now. I'm at a pivotal point of either diving headfirst into my career, and completely forgetting this lifestyle...or completely diving into this lifestyle and forgetting (or suspending) my career.

I feel like the career side is slipping away, and I want more time out of my Van/Backpack....the whole 'you sure you are making the right decision...?' Thing STILL keeps my up at night...and I havent been able to figure it out...for YEARS now.

...its getting hella annoying. Kinda like that adjective.

I've been kinda diving back into my pagan studies/philosophies, and this has been helping me in my decisions...making decisions for myself that are larger than myself, can help me help others/the planet/ecosystem ect....that has been helping with the whole, 'one decision isint the end of the world' mantra.

I dunno. This whole topic is a giant mindfuck...everytime it gets brought up.


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## Ameris (Nov 9, 2020)

#1: Remember you are a slavce.

#2: Remember our people were genocided between the late 1500's & early 200's.

#3: Remember you live under conditions as a continuing product of those genocides & ecocides.

#4: RTemember you are not free.

#5: Your freedom, if it cannot be defined in actions you are actually able to implement is perhaps primarily defined by your hate & anger, as well as your love.
DSo not condemn yourself for walking on what may be a trail of tears, or escorted to labor camps, or (if they could) gas chambers for your kind, when you are forced to march with guns trained upon your head.

6: Do not damn yourself because what you are able to do as a slave is insufficient, because you still understand & strive towards what you would do, if you were free.

7: In times of duress we see the rquirements of greater duty. Shall you be the Buddah, or the Christ or Leonidas? 
You would be, if you could.

We have already seen the insanity of one man tryingf to drive that kind of power home.

If it is not given to you, to the extent that you must clearly die for it, then simply use what you are given to do the good which is apparent to you.

Frankly, the sin of the world is so great that if punishment & war & fighting & conflict are able to cure it, there shall be little more than a handfull of us left.

& perhaps that is how ity should be, if whjat we have is the best we can do.

Love & simplicity & kindness are all single, individual intentions..

If somne sort of agreement must be reached, then the threshold for conflict is set.

therefore:

# 8: Let what you do be enough for you.
Do not deny perfection, but neither assume to know what it is.

We do not have the freedom to be insanely good.

We are damned, essentially, to trying to keep some kind of balance; some sort of equation between what we can give to what is actually needed, what harms ourselves, and what is given as a gamble towards needs which may be insincerely expressed to us.

Lies suck, but even worse is trying to figure the fuckers out.
So.. Leonidas may be fucking right.

Anyways..

#9: Shit is fucked up._ 
"And whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life, keep peace in your soul."_

so.. #10,
Desiderata - Wikipedia - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desiderata 

Read it.


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## EphemeralStick (Nov 10, 2020)

Coywolf said:


> I'm at a pivotal point of either diving headfirst into my career, and completely forgetting this lifestyle...or completely diving into this lifestyle and forgetting (or suspending) my career.


Yea, I was at that point back in September of 2019. Just lost my job growing weed, had to figure out something on the fly. I could either settle down and work on saving money to get myself a life that was my own or continue to float around in my van, working/living in places that were dependent on other people's situations. 

I chose to stay in New Orleans to try and buckle down and make something of myself. I dove head first not necessarily into a career, but definitely into the normal life. 

Part of me feels like I'm in this weird limbo of being too nomad to fit in with the normies but now also too normie to fit in with the nomads. Did I make the right choice? Who knows. Either way I ended up alone. 


Coywolf said:


> This whole topic is a giant mindfuck...everytime it gets brought up


Yeaaaa that it is. Though it might sound weird I'm glad you brought it up. These thoughts have been weighing on my mind for quite some time. Feels nice to get em out.


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## Beegod Santana (Nov 11, 2020)

Twice now I've walked away from niche industries that are hard to crack, the festival industry and the norcal medical scene. Both times I knew I was gonna be walking away for over a year and did nothing but fret about it. Once the time actually came however, I'd gotten to the point where leaving seemed like the only logical thing to do. 
With both jobs I felt the double life for a while, even on pot farms you can get labeled that crazy traveler person. What really scarred me was when I got so engrossed in those jobs I realized I was becoming nothing but those jobs. In festy land I was becoming your stereotypical coked out stage hand who was always pissed off and slept 10hrs a week. In Humboldt I lived weed from the second I opened my eyes till I went to sleep, everyday, maybe going to town once a month. I never worked on art or music out there, just weed. On the rare occasions I'd go visit people in town I'd piss them off, cause all I'd talk about was weed. 

With both jobs there was finally a country song style drunken blow out with my bosses where I told them to suck it and walked away. Both jobs called me the next morning asking when I was gonna calm down and come back to work and both times I got those calls I just laughed. I couldn't possibly fathom going back and didn't care what my next move was.

These days I farm for myself. I make a lot less $ and don't get to have rockstar moments nearly as often but my stress levels are a 10th of what they used to be. I've managed to turn a few of my hobbies into side hustles, have time to gig and no longer shit a brick every time I hear a helicopter. I really don't know if I'll be doing this in 10yrs but hey, that's life. 

So basically, I know it's hard, but remember careers and jobs come and go and you can do everything right and still get fucked royally. You have your whole life to work a cash register and honestly I'd rather do it as old man than in my 30's.


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## lizZygypsy311 (Mar 11, 2021)

Fritz said:


> Don't have much to add except that I've been reading through this thread & have found a wealth of information and comfort in everyone's perspectives. I'm glad you started this thread Coywolf. I'm not joking or being sarcastic when I say that reading these responses are better than some self help podcasts I've listened to. Not to go off on a tangent but a lot of "self help" media is geared towards making you a more "efficient" or productive worker drone as so you can live a cookie cutter life -one size fits all...to hell with that noise. Coywolf, I don't know you, and I definitely don't want to put words in your mouth but you sound like you know exactly what you want to do but you're still asking yourself permission. In my opinion, my own feelings as of late- the ratio of uncertainty with society is matched with my personal uncertainty and it's suffocating, if that makes any sense. It's like "why look at a calendar when everyday is the same ?" And how I try to shake out of that is by making plans. Some plans may be obtainable, some may not. I'm planning on hiking the Appalachian Trail. I'm the kind of person that has to have a carrot on the end of a stick and more often than not that carrot is freedom and not material goods. I'm working a crappy warehouse job at the moment and have worked my fair share of crappy jobs and as soon as I take on a job, as soon as I get hired I'm thinking "okay, what am I'm trying to achieve...a big or bigger tv every couple of years ?, upgrade my phone ? a new car ? -that I'll drive (collectively) maybe 3 hours a week but will pay four to five years on ? ,etc. .etc." A couple of months back I landed a job at a meat processing plant that specialized in pepperoni and I did an interview with this guy who was nice enough, and we conversed back and forth and he was forthright with me in confessing that the company had just recently gotten rid of some toxic employees and he said something that I agreed with but only because it was sadly true, he said "it's important to get along with your co-workers because we spend more time with them than our families." That's very true...and that's very screwed up to say the least. I lasted two days at that job, not because of that man's philosophy that I reluctantly agreed with but because sliding around on a bloody floor all day and spending the last two hours of an already grueling day cleaning equipment started killing my soul quicker than I'd guess. Now I run a forklift and load soaps & scented candles on and off of trucks, sometimes working the line. Glamorous ! But I'm working for the trail. More money, more miles.
> 
> Again, I just want to reiterate, how appreciative I am of this thread and all the responses. Shit is sideways right now to say the least and my hat goes off to everyone grinding it out. I'm gonna bounce before I get too sappy, lol. Toodles, safe travels, and I sincerely wish you the best because I'm a big fan of anyone who realizes , what's that Jiddu Krishnamurti quote ? - "_It is no measure of health to be well adjusted to a profoundly sick society."_


Krishnamurti, that fucker, he stole my life 😝


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## lizZygypsy311 (Mar 11, 2021)

Buzzkill said:


> Hey, I'm going through something similar. Not quite the same, but basically - I'm trying to do what I have to do get housed up and stay that way awhile, for financial reasons, and also for my long term survival in terms of a medical condition I struggle with. My mental health is deterioating badly for in a large part, the same reasons. Its killing me. I spent part of the summer suicidal. And similarly, I told myself for years stay cool and follow the path - once you actually get a "permanent" housing situation, it'll be worth it, you'll have a chance - this shit will clear up, it'll b e ok. Get out of the shit your in, that will solve that, it will be over.
> Yeah - exact problem you mentioned. That's not what happened. the shit didn't end, this didn't solve things, was not the turning point it was supposed to be
> 
> I feel you. I think we come from different pasts though
> ...


I’m reading a book now that makes the point: “man should not be subject to the law, but should be the subject of the law.”


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