# First time really sleeping rough, London



## Anagor (Mar 24, 2015)

Perhaps in the context of this forum rather mildly interesting, but I'll share anyway. 

Last Saturday night was the first time I really slept rough in a public place. Buckingham Palace Road, a minute away from Victoria Station.







View from my sleeping spot:






Was another new experience.  Just wanna share.
Cheers!


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## Tude (Mar 24, 2015)

Very cool!


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## Kal (Mar 24, 2015)

Stay safe. Are there any woods to make camp in? I never felt safe sleeping in a public place.


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## Anagor (Mar 24, 2015)

Kal said:


> Stay safe. Are there any woods to make camp in? I never felt safe sleeping in a public place.


Right now I'm back at home. Was (unfortunately) only a very short trip. I felt quite safe there, cause there was traffic (cars, buses, people) all night long.


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## Odin (Mar 24, 2015)

Thanks for sharing the pics. I can see how it was not too concerning. I have spent nights out in the city by the lake on porches and once on a community college campus bench... granted I was never alone and mostly just dosing for just a bit  ::drinkingbuddy::Cities are crazy but meh...


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## Matt Derrick (Mar 24, 2015)

i'm almost surprised no one bothered you there.


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## lone wolf (Mar 24, 2015)

i'm surprised you got any sleep in that spot. i prefer to be hidden, i'd have to be nearly dead to fall asleep there.


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## Odin (Mar 24, 2015)

That is because no one wants to mess with Anagor... 

His name is Anagor... continue walking.


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## Deleted member 20 (Mar 24, 2015)

I think that there is a profound difference between being homeless & being travelers in the US. One thing that I notice of those from the UK/EU is their exposure to most everything is from the point of view of a backpacker. Backpackers are tolerated & even have businesses that cater to them. When people speak of sleeping rough it is almost always an alternative to normally having a relatively cheap & clean hostel filled with other young student age backpackers. I am constantly scouting & improving my environment & planning on where I will crash that night.

Most of us experienced travellers wouldnt be caught dead sleeping out on the sidewalk exposed to foot traffic & road noise of passing cars unless there wasnt an option. Now I have hung out on many many sidewalks to just kick it & swap stories, spange, sing or just harass the locals. But I always slip away to a private area to sleep for the night, usually covered from the elements & possibly the wind, with access to electrical power to charge my phone & have running water & a place to use the bathroom close by (porta potty, public bathroom etc), often if possible I will have a campfire. I think that since hostels/motels are so expensive & almost never an option here in the US that we are used to finding suitable temporary shelter. From those pictures I can wonder how someone with all clean & expensive gear would fair to sleep out on the sidewalks of our big cities here in the US. Most homeless cant think past there mnetal illness & addictions & almost never improve their situations by improving or improvising a quality long term shelter. I put more care into a temporary shelter I will use for one night & be but a few blocks/miles from where the majority of the homeless congregate.

I am an american traveler, with a lifetimes worth of experiences surviving in style in many places in urban/rural & wilderness areas around North America. I think for anyone as cleancut as myself & @Anagor that there is no reason not to try to use couchsurfing if time & internet permits. Backpackers tend to be so young & spoiled with all of the infrastructure in the EU & so lost here in the States. Also here in the US, being homeless is like being its own type of people. they all speak the same gibberish & shuffle & smell the same regardless of where they are. I may be houseless but being homeless is like giving up on life!

Those pics of you Sleeping Rough out on the sidewalk in a large urban environment is like acting homeless here in the US with a huge target on your back that reads Rob me for my fancy ass expedition style gear & fanny pack full of cash, camera & other valuables.


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## Odin (Mar 24, 2015)

highwayman said:


> Those pics of you Sleeping Rough out on the sidewalk in a large urban environment is like acting homeless here in the US with a huge target on your back that reads Rob me for my fancy ass expedition style gear & fanny pack full of cash, camera & other valuables.



Good contrast there on Us/Euro, only thing I'm thinking is that his pics are in an urban environ but i don't see much foot traffic? might be a slow night out of the way street? did you sleep well Anagor?


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## Anagor (Mar 24, 2015)

Matt Derrick said:


> i'm almost surprised no one bothered you there.



Well, no one bothered me and I guess that's true for the other people sleeping there, too.



lone wolf said:


> i'm surprised you got any sleep in that spot. i prefer to be hidden, i'd have to be nearly dead to fall asleep there.



I fell asleep after half an hour I think. Woke up a few times throughout the night, but mostly cause it was a little bit cold (should have worn an additional layer of hoodie).



highwayman said:


> I think that there is a profound difference between being homeless & being travelers in the US.


Yes, I guess that's true.



highwayman said:


> One thing that I notice of those from the UK/EU is their exposure to most everything is from the point of view of a backpacker. Backpackers are tolerated & even have businesses that cater to them.


Yes. There are a lot of "backpacker hostels" in Europe.



highwayman said:


> When people speak of sleeping rough it is almost always an alternative to normally having a relatively cheap & clean hostel filled with other young student age backpackers. I am constantly scouting & improving my environment & planning on where I will crash that night.



Next night I slept at a hostel which is located 20 minutes away from Victoria Station at the Thames. 10 pounds for a clean dorm room bed, including free towel for showering in the morning, free soft drinks (coffee, pepsi or alike), 1 pound discount for pints of beer and free continental breakfast. 



highwayman said:


> Most of us experienced travellers wouldnt be caught dead sleeping out on the sidewalk exposed to foot traffic & road noise of passing cars unless there wasnt an option.



At this location I had no problems. Can't speak of other locations in London, though.



highwayman said:


> Those pics of you Sleeping Rough out on the sidewalk in a large urban environment is like acting homeless here in the US with a huge target on your back that reads Rob me for my fancy ass expedition style gear & fanny pack full of cash, camera & other valuables.



Well, take a look at my avatar. Photo was taken in Bristol in January, but despite the brown vest below the flap of the backpack I was looking the same the last time. No fancy ass expedition style gear, but an old army backpack, old sleeping bag, cheap sleeping pad and old clothes. I don't think anyone would assume I'd had much cash or other valuables with me.



Odin said:


> Good contrast there on Us/Euro, only thing I'm thinking is that his pics are in an urban environ but i don't see much foot traffic? might be a slow night out of the way street? did you sleep well Anagor?



I slept relatively well, was a bit cold, though. I took the picture as there wasn't a lot of foot trafic at 5am in the morning. But there was traffic all night long, as there were constantly buses coming by (buses and coaches) and people getting on and off.


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## Deleted member 20 (Mar 24, 2015)

I think from your avatar you look exactly like a rich backpacker from Europe. After meting a few people who came to the US the last being my pal @Hiceadha I dont want or expect anyone else to be filthy & or look more the US dirty traveler part (if they are not) but It seems that the cleancut look of a backpacker from the EU just feels like someone thats begging to be robbed especially if they are sleeping among the homeless.


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## Anagor (Mar 25, 2015)

highwayman said:


> I think from your avatar you look exactly like a rich backpacker from Europe.



Lol. Not here in Europe I guess. I mean, the homebum who slept next to me that night didn't look much different. He had a fancier backpack, though. And a warmer jacket. 

And I was offered food more than once and was given a pound by someone just sitting on my backpack at night in Bristol.



highwayman said:


> After meting a few people who came to the US the last being my pal @Hiceadha I dont want or expect anyone else to be filthy & or look more the US dirty traveler part (if they are not) but It seems that the cleancut look of a backpacker from the EU just feels like someone thats begging to be robbed especially if they are sleeping among the homeless.



I think there are quite a few differences between EU and US. Okay, there are punks here, too. But I never saw the typical "dirty kids", crusties or what you will call them here. At least not in UK and Germany.


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## Deleted member 20 (Mar 25, 2015)

Anagor said:


> I think there are quite a few differences between EU and US. Okay, there are punks here, too. But I never saw the typical "dirty kids", crusties or what you will call them here. At least not in UK and Germany.




We have much too many dirty crusties who look the traveler part complete with huge pack, pitbull & train patches but still live at home with their parents & have never traveled ever!. I guess my opinions are based on debunking the misconceptions that foreigners have about traveling here in the US/CA My input to this thread isnt specifically targeted towards you & is for any future visitors dreaming to come ride our rails & hitchhike route 66 or whatever other romantic idea of our american traveler culture. We kinda have a practical general style uniform & overall look where as tourists with a backpack & a passport have a specific yet opposite look here in the US/CA. We also use certain tactics & techniques to survive with style here in the US. Sorry to hijack your thread I just had to point out the differences that I noticed in how I do things.


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## Anagor (Mar 25, 2015)

highwayman said:


> Sorry to hijack your thread I just had to point out the differences that I noticed in how I do things.



No worries.  I do understand your point and it's good to mention it, especially since most of the people here are from US.


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## Anagor (Mar 26, 2015)

Just to clarify ...



highwayman said:


> Most of us experienced travellers wouldnt be caught dead sleeping out on the sidewalk exposed to foot traffic & road noise of passing cars unless there wasnt an option. Now I have hung out on many many sidewalks to just kick it & swap stories, spange, sing or just harass the locals. But I always slip away to a private area to sleep for the night, usually covered from the elements & possibly the wind, with access to electrical power to charge my phone & have running water & a place to use the bathroom close by (porta potty, public bathroom etc), often if possible I will have a campfire.



I wouldn't sleep like that every night. In fact - as said - I went to a hostel next night. For my next trip - perhaps with company - I intend to sleep outside more often if not almost always, so I/we will try to find more hidden places, I guess.

It was just that it got late this evening, I was tired and hostels (at least decent ones) are expensive on Saturday evenings. I had the gear needed with me (and never used it before there) so I thought "heck, give it a try" ... 

I sat there on my backpack for some time, watching the scenery. I felt relatively safe, so I rolled out my pad and sleeping bag, took off my shoes and got into the bag. Slept with my head on top of my backpack. Not the most comfortable sleeping experience I had so far, but it was okay.

Just wanted to clarifiy that sleeping like that would not be something I'd like to do every day for a longer period of time.


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## krynitz (Dec 30, 2016)

I've slept out around where you are there! I met the 2009 yo-yo grandmaster champion. Given its Victoria station, there's less homeless around than say, The Strand, and there's a few milling about waiting for trains or buses (what I was doing) that leave at uncomfortable hours. I wouldn't make it a home to sleep out often but there's none of the traffic that would intefere with just sleeping there a night. I lived in London for a while, I'm interested in how I'd maneouver sleeping rough there.

The homeless scene in London is also a lot different than any city in the US. The numbers are vastly different.

Its precisely this EU/US distinction I'm interested in. I don't disagree a single bit that its an alternative to backpacking, etcetera. There's certain commonalities - of being exposed to the weather, being outdoors and the practical considerations. These are beyond what you're debunking surely? Or am I missing something?

What fascinated me when I first went stateside is this established traveller culture, a gypsy movement that doesn't quite exist in the same way in Europe. I've been learning some of the ropes and digging deeper. I only recently really started grasping this "Also here in the US, being homeless is like being its own type of people. they all speak the same gibberish & shuffle & smell the same regardless of where they are. I may be houseless but being homeless is like giving up on life!" concept. 

Sure, I may remain a backpacker, but well, there's not much I can do about it but just carry on doing it, learning about it and figuring out how to handle myself regardless of the country (most of my experience is neither the US nor EU, but Mexico). Ironically, when I got to this side of the world I didn't have any money and lost all my gear within a week. Now I have some swish gear that I'm terrified to handle - whether I fuck it up myself or get it fucked up, stolen - that's been given to me in the US and extra money which comes from being in the US too. Maybe I just wisened up once I got out of my environment and the outcome would have been the same if I had gone the other direction.


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## Anagor (Dec 30, 2016)

Haha, it's kinda funny to read this post now, written by me over a year ago ...

"I wouldn't sleep like that every night."

Well, this year I was travelling most of the time (only back at my parent's house a few times for two weeks or so each) and I used hostels like three times iirc. Slept in caravans, squats, tents, but mostly just in some doorway. In London, Bristol, Brighton and other cities in UK, The Netherlands and Belgium.

I only booked a hostel as I was ill (catched a cold) twice and once on my way back to Germany cause I had some leftover money, hostel was cheap and I wanted to have a shower before visiting my parents.


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