# Should I buy this van?



## Matt Derrick

Just wanted to get some quick opinions on this vehicle I'm going to look at tonight:

http://austin.craigslist.org/cto/5461625887.html

My only hesitation so far is that it's not a high top, but i've seen some sweet guides to convert regular vans into high tops for cheap.


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## angerisagift

it looks SWEEEEEEET!!!!!!!!!!!! LIKE THE FACT the dude is moving sooooooo mayb can get it 4 cheap too


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## Haystack

Use the things that don't work to your advantage and start at $900. Id feel comfortable at the asking price (generally the prices are extremely high in my area so 1,800 is cheap for a van for my area), but I feel like you could get it for around 1,200 if you tried hard enough, maybe even less. Looks like a good candidate though. Good luck and let us know the outcome.


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## creature

just saw the post!

how many original miles?

it has a 6 digit odometer, so it's flipped & is effectively 130,000 miles.. 
1800 is too high for *any* 1986 vehicle, unless it is a factory conversion, and with the high mileage you may be looking at some issues..

i wouldn't let your desire to get a rig push you to buy it, unless you have to actually bug out..

pay absolutely positively no more than 900, unless the engine compartment is spotless & there's no indication of cut wires or other jerry rigging..

offer 8 & be ready to walk away, unless there is proof of some kind of rebuild.. actually match the vin & receipts..

take it for a drive..
make sure it shifts smoothly & on acceleration through the who power curve.. it should not wind out, going into drive.. it should if it's a 3 speed, it should engage at about 35 mph.. if it has an OD, that should engage at about 45...
does it have a tow hitch?

assume it has been used to tow..

hold off & see if he's sold it by the time he's left.

1600 is way, way too much.. if you are ***lucky*** & you pay a grand, you *might* get another problem free 30K out of it, but that's a dice throw.

listen carefully.. any clattering coming from inside, or is it nice & smooth?
if you accelerate in park, hard, is there any "tttttaaacccckkiing" as her RPMs drop?

a little is ok, but if it's loud, you've got valve issues..
any increase in fumes on hard revving?

look at the oil.. make sure there is no milkiness to it..

before it gets warm, look at the coolant?
no oil contamination, is there?

sending now.

wish i had seen earlier..

good luck!!


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## Matt Derrick

apparently another guy is offering 1600 so i dunno if i can start that low, but we'll see. the odometer did roll over, so it's about 130k which seems pretty good to me for a 30 year old vehicle. it's being sold by a friend of mine's roommate so i don't think she would have referred me to him if he wasn't trustworthy, but yeah, i'm going to give it a full look over. i only have about 1200 to my name right now, so i'm not really sure how it's all going to work out anyways.

i'm trying not to get too excited and be cynical about it so i don't shoot myself in the foot.


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## Johny

I'm looking at a 78 here for $750


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## creature

well.. see what kind of vibe you get..
hoses at least will be due before too long, & probably belts..
def check them..
hoses should not be distended at the clamps, & belts should be smooth & not cracked.

what's the status of the alternator, starter, water pump & fuel pump?
have they ever been replaced?

any leaking from the power steering unit?

how do the brake lines look? are they smooth & dark or grey, or do they look rusty?

how long has the vehicle lived in inner TX?
how many owners?

def check the trans fluid.. if it's *really* dark (brown & almost clear) that's a bad thing..
if it's light brown, but you can still see pink, you'll need to change..
if it's mostly pink, good..

also, 8 cylinder engines are expensive fuckers..


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## Kim Chee

If you decide to buy it, be sure the seller knows you're poor and they're getting all you have and that if you had more you'd pay it.

Damn that thing is gonna slurp gas like like a cumslut guzzles...well, you know.


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## BigChase

Looks nice to me but as we all know pictures can be deceiving. I wouldn't worry about the miles, I own a 1987 GMC G2500 Vandura and she's got 212k miles on her, original engine with the tranny rebuilt about 5 years ago, and she just made a 9 hour trip from Miami and a 5 hour each way trip to Ocala, both within the last 2 months, without missing a beat. This is my second Chevy/GMC full size van and I've always had good luck with them.. 7xMichael is right though, they do suck some gas. Be ready for that. I'd also heed Creature's advice and take your time and check EVERYTHING out, in detail. Good luck!


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## Phoenix

creature said:


> just saw the post!
> 
> how many original miles?
> 
> it has a 6 digit odometer, so it's flipped & is effectively 130,000 miles..
> 1800 is too high for *any* 1986 vehicle, unless it is a factory conversion, and with the high mileage you may be looking at some issues..
> 
> i wouldn't let your desire to get a rig push you to buy it, unless you have to actually bug out..
> 
> pay absolutely positively no more than 900, unless the engine compartment is spotless & there's no indication of cut wires or other jerry rigging..
> 
> offer 8 & be ready to walk away, unless there is proof of some kind of rebuild.. actually match the vin & receipts..
> 
> take it for a drive..
> make sure it shifts smoothly & on acceleration through the who power curve.. it should not wind out, going into drive.. it should if it's a 3 speed, it should engage at about 35 mph.. if it has an OD, that should engage at about 45...
> does it have a tow hitch?
> 
> assume it has been used to tow..
> 
> hold off & see if he's sold it by the time he's left.
> 
> 1600 is way, way too much.. if you are ***lucky*** & you pay a grand, you *might* get another problem free 30K out of it, but that's a dice throw.
> 
> listen carefully.. any clattering coming from inside, or is it nice & smooth?
> if you accelerate in park, hard, is there any "tttttaaacccckkiing" as her RPMs drop?
> 
> a little is ok, but if it's loud, you've got valve issues..
> any increase in fumes on hard revving?
> 
> look at the oil.. make sure there is no milkiness to it..
> 
> before it gets warm, look at the coolant?
> no oil contamination, is there?
> 
> sending now.
> 
> wish i had seen earlier..
> 
> good luck!!




So I am DEFINITELY PMING you when I get around to buying my future van ahaha


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## Mankini

that van is sweet......if you have $4000 to invest in tranny rebuild and engine overhaul. you could do that and after that youd have a van to pass on to yer grandkids. im more of a vw bus kinda guy but yeah. buy it. then start saving for rebuilds.


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## landpirate

I don't know enough about this type of van to have an opinion about price. But from a merely practical point of view I couldn't deal with living for an extended period of time in a non high top van.

My van is high top but the floor is raised to fit surf boards under (the previous owner surfed) I can stand up straight but I have seen the pain on taller people's faces when they crick their necks trying to move around. You might think that it doesnt really matter, how much standing up do you do in a van, maybe getting dressed? But when you're stuck in there all day because it's chucking rain down it's kinda nice to stand up straight and remember that you're not a hobbit!

If you know a way to convert it then I'd definitely factor that cost in to your budget.

Good luck though, it's so exciting when another van dweller joins the tribe


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## creature

Well.. @BigChase has the experience, & that's the best objective assessment you can get..
one of the main things is knowing how the van has been treated, & barring that are the noises coming out of the engine.. def check the fluid.. trans should be reasonably pink & not smell too funny.. a little on the sweeter side than on the burnt-rubberish.. literally the sort of difference between HDPE that is just starting to melt & HDPE that has turned brown & is starting to smoke.. if the trans fluid is 100% opaque & a hard brown, then it has *not* been maintained..

the high RPM to low RPM rattle test is a reasonable 'kick the tires' technique.. 
if you hear *knocks* from the low end, that's pretty bad.. the rev up may sound good, but it will be right as the engine settles back down into idle that you need to listen for a brief 'chocka-clokka-chocka-clokka' coming out of the bottom.. that's indicative of rod bearings on the crank.. higher up in the engine, but not so deep a knock can be wrist pins.. 
if you hear ratting coming out of the head, well.. usually in the valve/rocker/lift assembly..

but if she revs high & settles low with reasonable silence & smoothness, that's a good thing..

also listen as you turn the engine on & off because if the idle RPM is a bit high to begin with, you won't hear anything as it falls to low RPMs, so do the high RPM, and turn the key off & listen, right when she's above idle speed..

also, just as a talking point, ask when the last time was that it was timed.. timing can play bloody hell with an engine, when there's not really all that much wrong with it..

I've heard of many, many 6 & 8 cylinder blocks getting upwards of 200,000 miles, but a lot fail well before that, so it's always risky.. gasoline engines run at high RPMs, high detonation shock & high temperatures..
one something gets out of alignment the imbalance increases..

check the exhaust pipe.. wipe your finger around in it.. any evidence of excessive water or oil?
the soot should be mostly dry to powdery.. if it's dark & thick, it may be burning oil, which is not necessarily bad but get an idea of how much it uses.. 1 quart in 2,000 miles is just about the acceptable limit before it indicates a potential problems with rings, oil cooler hoses or possibly head gasket blow-by..

if it uses more than 1 in 1,500, you should be able to see some bluish tint to the exhaust, & that means either typical wear on rings for an engine with that mileage or possibly some leakage from the block into the exhaust.. if there's no blue tint, check the pan gaskets, valve cover gaskets & the oil cooler lines.. see if there are any oil stains on the exhaust.. 1 in 1,500 is fine, but you'll need to watch it in mountainous terrain..

make sure you check the amp meter & the temp gauge.. i dunno if it has a reservoir fill or a straight radiator cap, & this may be a bit much for a pre-purchase inspection, but if it has a cap then you can let it warm up & look at what your coolant flow is like.. 
in any case, after driving for 15 or 20 minutes, see what the engine heat is like.. turn it off, pop the hood & pass your hands around the top end..
inspect the valve covers.. basically see if the engine has been running clean or has been recently washed..

the main thing, though, & i kid you not, is to listen for the rattles & knocks as she transitions from high RPM down to idle to off... it should, ideally, be absolutely smooth..

blah blah yarghhhyarghh yarggh...


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## ByronMc

Hi Matt, been a long time, since I've been on here!
Been living in my van, since August, but had to get housed up, in February!
I got seriously ill, even hospitalized!
Anyway, I don't like high tops , am scared of leaks! In the photo, you'll see my roof racks,(need one more) & my plan is to take my old loft bed frame to make a platform! That way, I have a build in shade, storage & a place to sleep!
Buy that van, if it drives good, or can be repaired to drive good! Down the road, do what suits you, but in the meantime, you'll have a van!


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## creature

Byron, hope yer well!!

yeah.. the main thing is mechanical worthiness, for sure..

i'm playing the adversary, to some extent, but i've done a lot of road living, too..
i'm older, so i can't say if it was as hard as some of the youngn's, now, & i wind up housed up for a few months at a time as i spread my ass all over wherever it goes, but.. mechanical issues aside..
i really have to wonder if a standard size van is a good choice, just space-wise, if it's intended to be a dedicated dwelling... i mean, i have my vandura & it's fine for one person, but storage is always a major issue..
throw in a decent tool set, some reasonable spare parts, 5 gallons of fuel, a 5 gallon container of water, a food bin & some books or electronic crap, & shit gets clogged up *fast*..
i mean, storage up top, whether a carrier or rack or high-top cabinets is pretty well much standard for all long term rigs.. i agree, though, fer sure, though, that roof leaks absolutely, positively suck, no matter how manageable they are..

as much as the mechanical aspects are paramount (what good is a 2003 high top, if it's shittily engineered?), and as much as the 1986 design means user friendly maintenance, & as much as it may be a bird in the hand, i can't really say that it might not be wise to keep shopping around..
i bought my rig specifically for the power train, and as beautifull as she's been, if i i keep her & get the chance? i'm ripping her roof off & giving myself some additional enclosed space..

i mean, unless you have *just* a backpack, good basic tools & a small stove & are in a wagon or a sedan, an extended van is the very next step that should be taken, if possible, before migrating to a full RV..

a good deal is a good deal (say $1,200 for this rig, if she's been well kept & fluids maintained throughout her 130,000 mile life, though i wouldn't touch her for more than $500 at 230K) but if there's *time* to look around, and if the present money can be kept from being burned by the daily necessities of existence, i personally would keep shopping around..

an extended van vs. a standard van is easily worth +/- $400 in repairs, if they effectively cost the same..
& 400 doesn't fix much, but it can fix some basic non-fatal issues...

also, the conversion on this van is limited.. 
it's a great *camping* vehicle, or *utility* vehicle or even a great traveling / homie on the road vehicle (which i guess is what i am, basically), but it is *not* a good "this will be my home for 5 years" kind of rig..

As far as i know, that was one of the specs Matt had mentioned, so if a full time house-up on wheels is a requirement, the thing to do is put the money ****away****... like bury it in the desert or something & get another $500 together, and look around again.. at $1700 - $2000 (pretty well much the magic number) there are *scores* of deals to be had, & it's always better to be able to pick what you want to jump at, than to jump just because it looks good..

but.. i do agree, if time is a super critical element, & if this rig has only 130K on her, & if she doesn't seriously rattle, jolt or whine in the power train & isn't showing evidence of serious bleeding, she's a Buy, at $1,200 or less.. but not more than that, and $1,000 would be better..
if she's 230K, which is actually about *half* of what a 40 year old vehicle should have, she shouldn't even be considered.. i suspect, actually, that it's closer to 230K than 130, unless the seller is the original owner with documentation, rather than just the friend of a friend..
i mean, the person selling it could be the 3rd owner (or more), so who knows what's been lost in translation?

a 40 year old vehicle will average closer to 330K, assuming the last 15 years of it's like have seen only 8,000 miles of usage, each.

at 130K, she should be pretty fucking close to pristine, underneath & in the engine compartment..
the real tell may be the brake lines.. if those fuckers are seriously corroded anywhere along their run, for more than about 12", & show other corrosion spots, *or have been replaced* she has been **been on the road for *much* more than 130K**.. i don't mean just surface rust that you can scrape to grey metail with your finger nail, but... uhmm.. crusty.. ; )

i mean, if she was rigged out as a camper early, well.. maybe 130K is right.. lots & lots & lots of older RVs & RV camper vans come in at *under 100K*, and some date from the 70's, but that's because they were never intended for commercial or daily driving..

i mean, if she *has* 130K?
it really is fucking sweet..
me?
i'd be nervous as all fuck, unless until i could check out the clear majority of each point that mentioned so far, and that each point accessible passed the inspection *well*..

i mean, if she's clean & has *some* kind of documet, dating from about year 2005 that shows a service record (repair or oil change) with the odometer at under 99,000 miles, then yer golden.. def pick her up, based upon trust, if that's what yer comfortable with.
even a service record from 2000 would be to far away..

& dig this:

*anyone* who loves their vehicles enough to drive them gently over 4 fucking decades, to the point of having only 130K ***WILL***.. i repeat ***WILL*** have service records.

***WILL***

i'm not being a prick, repeating that, but unless the dog ate them, or there was a house fire, or they went up over the rainbow with dorthy, they *will* exist...

if they *don't*.. well.. i won't say yer being scammed, but *somebody* in the chain of title did *not* do what most owners of a classic, low mileage vehicle would.

anyways..

i'm done ranting at you, Matt..

sorry..

she def looks sweet, but if you *can* get her?
be carefull.. def make sure she's dry & clean..

if she is, & if you do get her, you'll do really, really well..

we'll see you eventually..


c


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## creature

BTW, matt... she *does* look clean.. pretty well much about what you would suspect from 130K, if her interior wasn't redone.. & it sure as hell looks original..

just remember.. clean & dry... clean & dry... no rattles, whines or knocks...


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## Matt Derrick

okay, sorry it took so long to get back to you all, and thanks for the plethora of useful answers!

i didn't check hardly any of the engine stuff since all the things you mentioned were so long that i'd need to print it out and i just didn't have a chance.

I did go see it and drive it. I really liked the style quite a bit, but I've been trying to hold out for a high top like @landpirate said. also, the brakes were really hard to press down, and didn't feel all that safe to me. in addition the speedometer stopped working while I was driving it, and the driver side door didn't open from the inside, and the power windows were a mess and didn't work on the passenger side. also, the window was cracked more than you could tell in the pictures.

like i said, i loved the style, but those things plus the fact that it just didn't quite 'feel' right made it obvious to me that it wasn't a good match.

although i'll still keep an eye out for camper vans in the future, i'm pretty heavily leaning towards getting a short bus with a diesel engine since I had such a good experience with my last school bus I owned several years ago. it just seems like the right combination of price, reliability, and space.

so, if you see anything like that lying around, please let me know  thanks for all the support!


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## creature

cool beans. mistah..


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## landpirate

You've got to test drive a lot of crappy vans before you find the right one, its the unwritten rule.


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## whimsicaliber

[QUOTE="My only hesitation so far is that it's not a high top, but i've seen some sweet guides to convert regular vans into high tops for cheap.[/QUOTE]

Can you point us to those guides? I have had a hard time with google leading to any useful info in this vein, and some extra headroom in our '94 Chevy G20 would be mighty sweet...


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## whimsicaliber

Aah, fucked up the quoting thing, I am bad at things sometimes


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## goatfloat6000

hey people - really glad i stumbled across this thread, it's a fucking gold mine of information... i've been living in my beater 85 chevy g20 for 8 months (street parking) and i'm looking for something fit for cross country travel. 

i can't post a link but there's a 2001 Dodge Ram 1500 on craigslist for $1000 with another $1000 quoted to repair one of the brakes and a "small crack in the frame" - it's under 90,000 miles though and this offer seems too good to pass up.... 

judging from the post and the email, the dude listing it seems yuppie-esque and probably doesn't know how much the thing is worth. the interior looks in great shape and was all built out by this dude. i'm concerned about downsizing space-wise but it may be worth it gas wise with the v6. is this offer too good to pass up? judging from my craigslist prowling of the last couple weeks, i could be spending close to 2,000 on something much older with high mileage.

wish i could post the link but this is my first post here


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## Haystack

goatfloat6000 said:


> hey people - really glad i stumbled across this thread, it's a fucking gold mine of information... i've been living in my beater 85 chevy g20 for 8 months (street parking) and i'm looking for something fit for cross country travel.
> 
> i can't post a link but there's a 2001 Dodge Ram 1500 on craigslist for $1000 with another $1000 quoted to repair one of the brakes and a "small crack in the frame" - it's under 90,000 miles though and this offer seems too good to pass up....
> 
> judging from the post and the email, the dude listing it seems yuppie-esque and probably doesn't know how much the thing is worth. the interior looks in great shape and was all built out by this dude. i'm concerned about downsizing space-wise but it may be worth it gas wise with the v6. is this offer too good to pass up? judging from my craigslist prowling of the last couple weeks, i could be spending close to 2,000 on something much older with high mileage.
> 
> wish i could post the link but this is my first post here



The yellow one?


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## goatfloat6000

yup


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## Kim Chee

@goatfloat6000, welcome! 

The way this is supposed to work is you go make a new thread to talk about the sweet van you found and are considering purchasing. ::rules::


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## goatfloat6000

Kim Chee said:


> @goatfloat6000, welcome!
> 
> The way this is supposed to work is you go make a new thread to talk about the sweet van you found and are considering purchasing. ::rules::


my bad, wasn't sure what the rule was and didn't want to take up space making a new thread if it wasn't necessary. I'll fix that


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